oldno82 Posted October 29, 2014 Share Posted October 29, 2014 Matt Elam is not doing well at all but I was surprised it was this bad: http://www.baltimoresun.com/sports/ravens/ravens-insider/bal-matt-elams-season-a-mixed-bag-of-occasional-big-plays-frequent-missed-tackles-coverage-lapses-20141029-story.html He and Arthur Brown are looking like busts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
varaven45 Posted October 29, 2014 Share Posted October 29, 2014 Elam is a fish out of water. Haven't seen Brown on the field so the jury is still out on him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robjr83 Posted October 29, 2014 Share Posted October 29, 2014 Hold judgement...Jimmy Smith till last year was in that same argument Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tsylvester Posted October 29, 2014 Share Posted October 29, 2014 Hold judgement...Jimmy Smith till last year was in that same argument At least Smith could cover in college, and the Ravens had a bid of a caveat, since college is a bit lenient on PI calls, allowing the db's to hand fight all the way down the field. Elam never could cover and usually missed tackles in college because he hit people instead of wrapping up on tackles. I was big mouthed on him being a bust when they drafted him and doubt there will come a time when I will have to eat my words. Brown has been a big disappointment, for me & the Ravens. He hasn't seen this field this year and likely won't save an injury, he just can't get the system down, even in practice he is out of position more than in.... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tornado700 Posted October 30, 2014 Share Posted October 30, 2014 For a first round pick, answer is yes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TBird Posted October 30, 2014 Share Posted October 30, 2014 Cyprien was the other top choice at that spot and many of us wanted him. Ravens took Elambecause of their Florida connections and one Ravens assist coached help recruit Elam for Florida. BTW, Cyprien hasn't done much better either. He's been injured a lot so he's been impeded by that. It's too early to judge either one. Give it 2 more years before judging. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
papasmurfbell Posted October 30, 2014 Share Posted October 30, 2014 Hold judgement...Jimmy Smith till last year was in that same argumentexactly what I was going to say. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rastaman831226 Posted October 30, 2014 Share Posted October 30, 2014 Hold judgement...Jimmy Smith till last year was in that same argumentbingo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robjr83 Posted October 30, 2014 Share Posted October 30, 2014 Reid was the best safety by stats...Vacarro was taken earlier and is has similar numbers to Elam. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldno82 Posted October 30, 2014 Author Share Posted October 30, 2014 I expect a first round pick to contribute right away and other than providing a body to put in that position I don't think Elam has contributed. Brown is a second round pick that can't even make the active list on Sundays. It's been 2 years and that to me tells me he ain't going to make here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
papasmurfbell Posted October 30, 2014 Share Posted October 30, 2014 Well sometimes they don't contribute right away. Smith is a great example. So is Bryant in Dallas. He had a bit of a rocky rookie season. Also Elam was pick 32. Basically he is a glorified 2nd rounder. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thundercleetz Posted October 31, 2014 Share Posted October 31, 2014 I agree with the sentiment in this topic. With Elam it is important to remember he is only 22 years old, younger than a lot of rookies this season. He was a true junior coming out and was mainly a runningback in high school. I don't think he'll ever be an impact player, but maybe he can be a late bloomer. As papa said a pick that late is basically a second rounder. Look at the safeties drafted recently, there are a lot of high round picks that ended up as average players at best. The Bucs just traded Barron two years removed from being a top ten pick. It's hard finding the next playmaker like Earl Thomas or Jairus Byrd. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldno82 Posted October 31, 2014 Author Share Posted October 31, 2014 I wonder who else was available with the pick we used to draft Elam... Well, at least Elam is playing, though poorly. Brown can't even get activated on game day. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
papasmurfbell Posted October 31, 2014 Share Posted October 31, 2014 I wonder who else was available with the pick we used to draft Elam... Well, at least Elam is playing, though poorly. Brown can't even get activated on game day.Gio was 5 picks later. I wouldn't pick a RB that high but he is damn good. Later in the 2nd was Kiko Alonso and Le"Von Bell. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldno82 Posted October 31, 2014 Author Share Posted October 31, 2014 Interesting...thanks Pops. I stand by opinion toward Elam and Brown. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TBird Posted November 1, 2014 Share Posted November 1, 2014 Here's an article right after the Elam draft that starts out saying you have to wait 3 years to judge a draft but here's their opinon on certain teams that nailed it. They say Ravens had a solid draft patiently waiting for Elam to fall then moving up to get Brown. They call it a solid draft. Elam was expected to go higher and so wasCyprien so we were surprised when both were there. Arthur Brown's problem seems to be learning the system. He was a good physical player in college, same as Chykie Brown but both have not been able to transfer their contributions to the pro game for whatever reason. But check out what it says about Jets and Geno. Also, the GM tradedRevis for picks but drafted a guy who doesn't even fit into Rex's scheme which is 3-4. He never played it. http://www.nfl.com/draft/story/0ap1000000165023/article/2013-nfl-draft-winners-minnesota-vikings-detroit-lions-nail-it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TBird Posted November 1, 2014 Share Posted November 1, 2014 Kiper calls it a good draft and said Arthur Brown was a steal @ 56. He was a player the Ravens really wanted. Ravens needed starters and got them in Elam and Brown. He was sure wrong about Brown but got starters out of people he didnt think, not this quick. He said Brandon Williams would be a good backup to Mt Cody who has been injured the last two years. Williams is now the starter and taking up 2-3 blockers freeing upMosley and others. He mentions KJ who was the best full back in that draft and now KJis starting. He said Wagner was an interesting pick and a year before Kiper thought he'd go in second round but didn't play up to it. He was injured and Ravens drafted him while still injured. Now he's the starting RT and has played well. Someone wrote thatRavens have the best right side of the o-line in the NFL with Yanda and Wagner. So to recap, the starters we got are now Elam, Brandon, KJ and Wagner. I don't think Mel counted on last 3 being the starters thisquick, only Elam and Brown who would make Ravens contenders. Man, was he fooled or what. http://insider.espn.go.com/nfl/draft2013/story/_/id/9200335/2013-nfl-draft-mel-kiper-gives-grades-every-nfl-team-draft Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldno82 Posted November 1, 2014 Author Share Posted November 1, 2014 We definitely did well after rounds1 & 2. It's those first two picks that bother me. The draft is always a crap shoot and I don't blame Ozzie for them. But I doubt Brown will be on the team after this season. Elam has a real long way to go to justify him being a true first team player. Right now he'd be lucky to be a backup on a lot of teams. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TBird Posted November 1, 2014 Share Posted November 1, 2014 Like I said Elam was projected to go higher and dropped, now we know why. Rob Long never liked him. He was upset on draft night and dissed him on Sunday saying he never could cover, not in college and not now. Kiper's link said he was good coming up in the box and hitting the guy before he got out and that's HARBs kind of guy. That's what Jimmy and Webbie do so well but they can cover. So far Elam hasn't but give it time. He cost us the Packers game last year when WEbbie guessed wrong thinking he had back up and Elam ran to the wrong side of the field. GB scores go ahead TD late in game. There were at least two other games lost because of Elam. That's the trouble of starting rookies, especially in key positions. Old school coaches would never do that. Rookies are gonna cost you and Elam did but he came on strong the last 3 games, but this year he reverted back to the beginning of last year. Like I said, Arthur Brown seems to have trouble learning the system. That's why he can't even be active. It's something mental. He was projected as round 1 pick but dropped. Oz traded up in front of Dallas and Houston who wanted him bad. Dallas would have drafted him if Ozzie didn't. You just gotta give these rookies some extra time while the unexpected guys in the later rounds shined and unexptectedly. Look what undrafted FA Marlon Brown did last year. He hasn't been targeted as much this year because Kubes is using his size and speed as a dcoy to lure the safety out of the route of Smith Sr who has been targeted 87% of the Ravens offensive plays. The safety can't take the chance of letting Marlon roam. There's rumors of one team, don't know who, that is really interest in Arthur Brown and tried to trade for him but Ozzie said no. If he can ever get his head straight and learn the system watch out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ForceEight Posted November 1, 2014 Share Posted November 1, 2014 You just gotta give these rookies some extra time while the unexpected guys in the later rounds shined and unexptectedly. Look what undrafted FA Marlon Brown did last year. He hasn't been targeted as much this year because Kubes is using his size and speed as a dcoy to lure the safety out of the route of Smith Sr who has been targeted 87% of the Ravens offensive plays. The safety can't take the chance of letting Marlon roam. I can't even begin to figure out where you pulled that wonderful information from. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TBird Posted November 1, 2014 Share Posted November 1, 2014 Im sorry, SR lined up as outside receiver 87% of the snaps. He's still the go to guy for most of those snaps. They just started using Torrey who has 3 TDs in last two games. Marlon is being used as a decoy most of the time luring the safety away with his size. How do you think SR is getting open so much? It's all discussed in detail here but don't tell Craven. RSR is a dirty word to him. http://russellstreetreport.com/forum/showthread.php?122221-BSL-All-22-look-at-all-6-Ravens-WRs-the-role-they-play-in-offense-routes-typically-ran-and-more Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tsylvester Posted November 1, 2014 Share Posted November 1, 2014 It has all been discussed here, no need to run over there, one just needs to pay attention..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TBird Posted November 1, 2014 Share Posted November 1, 2014 What was the thread, With detailed diagrams and analysis complete with pics showing the receiversand their routes, not just fans opinions? I was just trying to contribute something and someone called me out on the source but theinfo is correct even if you don't like it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vmax Posted November 1, 2014 Share Posted November 1, 2014 Marlon is not a decoy. Joe would love it if he could get open and not drop the ball.Brown, Torrey and Jacoby don't get thrown to because the want to set a record for drops.Joe throws to Steve and Daniels because they catch the ball.It's not rocket science that needs diagrams, spread sheets and Dr Phil analysis. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TBird Posted November 1, 2014 Share Posted November 1, 2014 Joe went to him a lot last year as the 3rd WR. Kubes came in and uses Marlon's big body to lure the safety away from SRs route.If they wanted to get Brown the ball, he would have been moved outside. He lines up in the slot 70% of the time. Again, SR lines up on the outside 87% of the time and he is the go to guy. Joe didn'teven go to Torrey til recently. In the pic in the link both Marlon and Aiken are lined up on the outside. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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