Interesting Read on Lamar

[oldno82]

https://digitaledition.baltimoresun.com/html5/desktop/production/default.aspx?pubid=99644e1a-52da-4fe3-8f78-a84e4fe4d386&edid=59721d6c-498f-4aa5-83a2-644b1b372703

Talks about his development at QB...

[tsylvester]

Eh, pay wall, can't read it. I hope they talked about his inability to throw the long ball accurately. Sure, 20 yards and in he seems to be fine, but deeper throws he is way off target most times.

He doesn't seem to have developed the touch pass to drop it in a bucket over a backer in front of the safety without it being high... time will tell

[oldno82]

*^%$#!!!

Try this:

 

 

 

At the Ravens’ sprawling headquarters and practice facility in Owings Mills — 200,000 total square feet, with its indoor field and weight room accounting for about half of it — Lamar Jackson takes a seat at a long table inside one of the first-floor meeting rooms inside “The Castle,” as the massive complex is affectionally known. At the head of the table is first-year quarterbacks coach Tee Martin. Jackson sits to his immediate left, backup Tyler Huntley next to Jackson and No. 3 quarterback Josh Johnson to Martin’s right, while assistant quarterbacks coach Kerry Dixon mans the computer further down the table.

While the stadium is where the magic happens for Jackson and the 8-3 Ravens, this is where much of the work takes place for the quarterback.

 

 

[ Ravens TE Mark Andrews has an ‘outside chance’ to return from ankle injury this season ]

“Lamar’s like any other student,” says Martin, who spent the previous two seasons as Baltimore’s wide receivers coach and 25 years ago was the quarterback for national champion Tennessee. “He comes in with his bookbag, takes out his notepad, takes out his pen or pencil and just about every word that comes out of my mouth he’s taking it in.

“If there’s something that hits his brain a certain way, he’ll ask a question. He’s very good about being clear to make sure there’s clarity to whatever it is that you’re saying. He’s not shy about asking questions. He doesn’t play around in meetings. He’s a creative thinker. He’s meticulous about things. When you put a play in, he has this blank stare, because he’s playing the play in his mind. A lot of guys can’t do that.”

 

 

 

Most in the NFL also haven’t done what Jackson has this season.

[ Ravens linebacker Tyus Bowser launches nonprofit to help disadvantaged youth in Baltimore City ]

His 69.5% complete rate is the fifth-highest mark in the NFL, his 2,441 yards passing are 10th and his 8.1 yards per attempt ranks fourth. Jackson’s 535 rushing yards, meanwhile, lead the league and are nearly 150 more than the next closest quarterback, the Vikings’ Josh Dobbs, and his five rushing touchdowns are the third-highest total in the league.

 

 

But the evolution of Jackson, who was the NFL’s unanimous Most Valuable Player in 2019, has reached another level this season beyond just statistics.

Thursday night against the Bengals, the Ravens were facing third-and-7 from Cincinnati’s 11-yard line with 28 seconds remaining in the first half. Baltimore had its receivers stacked in a two-by-two formation against man coverage. At the snap, Jackson looked to his right, where wide receiver Zay Flowers, tight end Isaiah Likely and running back Justice Hill were all well covered. So he looked left, where he had Nelson Agholor breaking over the middle and Rashod Bateman working on the outside against Cameron Taylor-Britt.

Agholor was open but going away from Jackson as he broke the pocket to his left. Jackson’s movement to the left also forced cornerback Mike Hilton to make a choice: play Jackson one-on-one, or the passing lane. He chose the former, moving toward the quarterback and in doing so opened a window in the end zone for Bateman, who cut in, with Jackson flinging a dart for a touchdown.

Ravens quarterback Lamar Jackson, second from right, celebrates a touchdown to wide receiver Rashod Bateman, right, with wide receiver Odell Beckham Jr., left, and wide receiver Nelson Agholor in the second quarter of Thursday's game against the Bengals. (Karl Merton Ferron/Baltimore Sun)

The score put the Ravens up 21-10 at the half and helped bury the Joe Burrow-less Bengals in a hole they couldn’t get out of.

 

There were other plays where Jackson’s progressions stood out, too. Earlier on the drive, he found Odell Beckham Jr. on a corner-stop route for 15 yards after his eyes moved Cincinnati corner Chide Awuzie back toward the middle of the field. And earlier in the second, he connected with what appeared to be his third option in Beckham for 29 yards to set up the Ravens’ second touchdown.

[ Ravens WR Odell Beckham Jr., with legs back underneath him, is starting to look like his old self ]

Of course, it helps to have playmakers around him.

 

Flowers is second among rookie receivers in catches (53) and fourth in yards (588). Beckham has started to show signs of his old self the past few weeks. Bateman is healthy and has made some crucial catches. There was also ever-dependable tight end Mark Andrews, until he suffered what is likely a season-ending ankle injury in the first quarter Thursday night (though coach John Harbaugh offered a glimmer of hope Monday).

Then there is the new scheme under offensive coordinator Todd Monken, who has empowered Jackson to have more input and control and opened the playbook up more the more comfortable the quarterback has become.

It took some time and is still a work in progress, but the Ravens have found an identity and rhythm over the past month, scoring 34, 31, 37, 31 and 38 points in their past five games.

“He was a very quick study,” Martin said of Jackson. “He’s a quick learner. He doesn’t need a lot of reps to learn things and he sees the game a certain way. Coming in, the terminology, once we got over that bridge of what we used to call it to what we call it now, things that are different, things that are new, introducing him to those concepts and ideas, it all became his own from that point on.

“We talked about empowering the quarterback as far as protections, as far as being able to change routes. He loved it.”

“I’m more vocal than I was before,” said Ravens quarterback Lamar Jackson, quieting the crowd during Thursday's game against the Bengals. (Karl Merton Ferron/Baltimore Sun)

There’s been a noticeable growth within the walls of the quarterback room as well.

 

“I’m more vocal than I was before,” Jackson said. “Early on [in my career], I was just wanting to learn the ins and outs of defenses in the NFL. But now, [with] me just seeing them each and every week — different defenses every week — I’ve got a lot more questions. I see certain things, and then I want to just tell Coach Monken, ‘We should try to put this in the game plan’ [and] stuff like that.”

The other quarterbacks can see a difference, too.

[ Where the Ravens turn after injury to TE Mark Andrews on controversial hip-drop tackle ]

Huntley, whose locker is next to Jackson’s and who signed as an undrafted free agent with the Ravens two years after Baltimore drafted Jackson in 2018, says the former Heisman Trophy winner has taken command in meetings and in the huddle.

“He’s just coming into himself, on and off the field, doing what he needs to do to make himself better, putting in the work,” Huntley said.

Johnson, who has played for an NFL-record 14 teams and is in his third stint with the Ravens, sees Jackson for the dynamic playmaker he is but also as someone whose football IQ is high.

“He’s who he’s advertised to be,” Johnson said. “He’s been dominant since he’s gotten in to the league. To me, the proof is in his play. If you question who he is as a player, I question how much you know about football. I don’t know what the public thinks of [Jackson]; I know what I think of [Jackson]. I respect him to the highest.”

 

Backup quarterback Tyler Huntley, center, says Lamar Jackson, left, has taken command in meetings and in the huddle. (Kenneth K. Lam/Baltimore Sun)

Still, Jackson has endured more than a few hiccups this season.

He has fumbled 10 times, losing six of them. He has also thrown five interceptions. And he has been sacked 27 times, which is on pace for the most of any season in his career, after, in many cases, holding onto the ball too long.

But he has also shown his toughness. This season, he has taken a handful of notable hits, including a few earlier this month against the Browns. Then against the Bengals on Thursday, he injured his ankle at the end of the first quarter and was examined in the team’s medical tent.

[ Ravens wide receivers step up after Mark Andrews’ injury in win over Bengals: ‘It’s going to take everybody’ ]

It was momentarily frightening for a franchise that had already lost Andrews and seen Jackson suffer leg injuries each of the past two seasons. But he emerged with a thumbs-up and didn’t miss a play.

“We all know who he is,” Beckham said of Jackson. “He’s the leader of this team, and everybody feeds off him. So, when we see him come back out, it makes you … whatever you have going on, you feel like you’re hurting, he’s out there, [so] we’ve all got to be out there. It was a big leadership moment by him.”

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And perhaps will ultimately lead to his biggest season yet.

[oldno82]

38 minutes ago, tsylvester said:

Eh, pay wall, can't read it. I hope they talked about his inability to throw the long ball accurately. Sure, 20 yards and in he seems to be fine, but deeper throws he is way off target most times.

He doesn't seem to have developed the touch pass to drop it in a bucket over a backer in front of the safety without it being high... time will tell

No it doesn't address his overthrowing deep balls (although he did hit OBJ on 1 of the 3 he threw deep last game), but he does seem to have a good grasp of what and how the offensive parts mesh together and it shows his work ethic. Hopefully he'll connect more often on his deep throws in the next few weeks. Hopefully..

[tsylvester]

Well, I think we have seen enough, Lamar is not accurate throwing the ball 30 + yards down field in a line, ie, with the receiver running away from him.

It is not even close! Today it took a great, phenomenal catch and roll by Obj to complete that poorly thrown ball.

Several others, he had receivers open by 2, 3, 4 steps, behind the defender and still, Lamar over threw, in one case, under threw resulting in a pick.

He had Obj one on one with the defender on the field side. All Lamar had to do was through toward the flag, the sideline and it is a touchdown.

He had plenty of time today, this may have been the best pass blocking this line has done in years, yet Lamar still could not make that/those deep shots accurately.

Obviously ya can't stop throwing them, calling them, but clearly less is more.

[papasmurfbell]

Its platitudes and hiding the stats that dont look good.

[oldno82]

Well  it looks to me too that he's accurate on short to medium throws but that he just doesn't have it for throwing deep when receiver is running downfield. And I don't think it's correctable after all these seasons.

He's not a complete passer like Stafford and others are but his ability to extend plays helps, a little, to make up for it. I guess it's one of those situations where you've got to take the good with the bad.

And you're right...you can't stop calling them but they should be called just enough to keep the opposing defenses honest.

[tsylvester]

Well, here we are again, another Super Bowl and another one where no running, predominantly, quarterback has won said game.

Of note, Lamar won his 2nd MVP, seasonal, he is now the only 2 time MVP as qb to have not won a Super Bowl,

Tom Brady, Brett Favre, Patrick Mahomes, Peyton Manning, Joe Montana, Aaron Rodgers, Johnny Unitas, Kurt Warner and Steve Young, have all won at least one Super Bowl.

Now, he is young, he is transitioning to becoming more of a pocket passer, so he has time.

Yes, I know, Steve Young was once a dual threat, run first qb per se, but once he got traded to San Fran, he put more work into being a pocket passer who could kill you with his legs.

I haven't looked up the stats, nope, don't have the energy to do so, but I would say, rushing for less than 500 yards while passing for more than 2500, would qualify as a proverbial "non running qb" stat line.

I see where he has really put the work in this past season, the growth was great. He just lost site of it in the KC game. I'm looking forward to see how he progresses next season.

[oldno82]

Well as you said he's still young. There's no doubt he sees the future as a pocket passer rather than a running quarterback.

He did screw it up in the KC game. Forgot about his running backs. Or maybe that was Monken. We don't really know.

[tsylvester]

It wasn't just running the ball. Even with those passing plays, he had receivers open, short, some in the flat. But he ignored then to try and get the ball down field.

Had he just done in the first 3 quarters, what he finally did in the 4th, they would have won.

[papasmurfbell]

Blitz him and keep him in the pocket and he self destructs.  These DCs will start copying each other.

[tsylvester]

Miami, SanFran, Houston, etc tried that, how did that go?

MVP, number 1 seed.

[oldno82]

Lamar's no dummy. Hopefully, he learns from the KC game and makes the appropriate adjustments next time. He's young yet. Elway, Manning and others were nearing the end of their careers when they finally won 'the big one'. And Dan Marino never did.

We probably won't have another shot at the big prize for a little while due to free agency and cap constraints, but I bet he improves and will be ready and even more hungry for a title next time the opportunity arises.

And, who knows? Maybe EDC has some more magic in his wand and can put together another contender sooner than we think.

[papasmurfbell]

9 hours ago, tsylvester said:

Miami, SanFran, Houston, etc tried that, how did that go?

MVP, number 1 seed.

No they didnt.  So often they would have someone leave their responsibility and try to get the sack and contain was blown.  Also which I didnt mention not sticking with the run on their part.

[papasmurfbell]

5 hours ago, oldno82 said:

Lamar's no dummy. Hopefully, he learns from the KC game and makes the appropriate adjustments next time. He's young yet. Elway, Manning and others were nearing the end of their careers when they finally won 'the big one'. And Dan Marino never did.

We probably won't have another shot at the big prize for a little while due to free agency and cap constraints, but I bet he improves and will be ready and even more hungry for a title next time the opportunity arises.

And, who knows? Maybe EDC has some more magic in his wand and can put together another contender sooner than we think.

Then we look at other QBs like Cam, McNair, Wilson, and McNabb where the hits pile up and they dont have that old player time to transition.

[oldno82]

Well, that's why it's a good thing Lamar is transitioning now at age 27.

[tsylvester]

10 hours ago, papasmurfbell said:

No they didnt.  So often they would have someone leave their responsibility and try to get the sack and contain was blown.  Also which I didnt mention not sticking with the run on their part.

Yes, they did, 0 blitz, rush lanes, late corner blitzes. Just because the line held, or Lamar relaxed and threw to the hot read, was able to avoid it, buy time and find open receivers does not mean that they didn't try.

KC only had success because Lamar tried to do too much. It wasn't so much the blitz that he has seen most, if not all season, maybe it was just the pressure of the game?

Maybe he just wanted it too badly.

[papasmurfbell]

7 hours ago, oldno82 said:

Well, that's why it's a good thing Lamar is transitioning now at age 27.

That transition I believe was been started 3 yrs to late.

[papasmurfbell]

1 hour ago, tsylvester said:

Yes, they did, 0 blitz, rush lanes, late corner blitzes. Just because the line held, or Lamar relaxed and threw to the hot read, was able to avoid it, buy time and find open receivers does not mean that they didn't try.

KC only had success because Lamar tried to do too much. It wasn't so much the blitz that he has seen most, if not all season, maybe it was just the pressure of the game?

Maybe he just wanted it too badly.

I look at plays like the one where they sent the safety and Stanley was blocking him.  There was no rush there.  When Lamar started to break to the left to get out of the pocket the safety moved to keep that contained edge.  Lamar then moved to the right back into the heart of the pocket.  If memory serves someone else made Lamar throw it for nothing.  That kind of rush non rush was going down all night.  That is a very new kind of way to defend Lamar.  

[tsylvester]

Teams have been doing that for years against running quarterbacks. Sometimes it works, some time it does not.

When you hold off the rush and have your linebackers/safeties tied up in keeping the running quarterback from breaking free, plays open up behind them.

This is what Lamar was looking for, but hanging onto the ball too long, most times.

This is also why, in the 4th, Hill, Gus, we're able to gain big yards from the flat. Lamar finally settled down and dumped it down; big gains.

It was open all game but Lamar was locked in to deep passing for what ever reason.

Against Houston, he did the same but found the open man quicker, mostly because Kc has a faster secondary. The way you best them is short passing, a lot of first downs, move down the field.

This would have forced them into coverage, rather than spying, which would have opened his running lanes in the 4th.

[papasmurfbell]

It wont be 100% successful.  That said with Lamar having limited progression skills it works enough to frustrate him.

[tsylvester]

Well, it did in this one game. Their defensive secondary plays a match up zone, with their speed it frustrates a lot of quarterbacks.

But Lamar made a lot of progress this year, maybe you can't see it, maybe, you don't want to see it.

Yes, he still has a ways to go but clearly has put alot of work in, according to his teamates, proof on the field.

Will he ever be able to drop a pass in 25 yards down field along the sidelines? Or a true back shoulder throw?

I hope so, time will tell.

[papasmurfbell]

He did make progress this yr.  The problem is to little to late.  He wasted at least 1500 hits on a system that didnt let him grow and expand his skillset.  He is about halfway through his career and he finally made the first expansions of his skills.  If they were going to be all in on Lamar them be all in on Lamar and dont keep that nepotism hiring train rolling.

[oldno82]

I don't see where Todd Monken is from the 'nepotism hiring train'.

 

[papasmurfbell]

Monken is the to little to late part.  Keeping Roman so long was the nepotism part.