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Is Secondary Getting Better?


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I read this and thought...yea...maybe they are getting better.

Thanks to Webb.

 

For the season, Foxworth has deflected a team-high 11 passes.

 

“Domonique, when you look at the tapes — and again it’s the position — you may see the one play that he doesn’t do great or slips or doesn’t do what he should do,” Mattison said. “We see the whole game and we feel like Domonique and the entire secondary … they just keep working every day to get better and they have gotten better.”

Overall, the secondary is gradually improving as well as the entire defense. The Ravens have allowed an average of just 11.3 points and 181 passing yards over the past three weeks. They intercepted Indianapolis Colts quarterback Peyton Manning twice and held him to one touchdown pass.

http://www.carrollcountytimes.com/articles/2009/12/06/sports/3_ravens_foxworth.txt

 

We know the pass rush is critical to how well the secondary holds up but take that out of the equation for a moment and the question is: Is the secondary improving?

 

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Hell NO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

Zibby, Carr, Foxworth, Landry..all are horrible.

 

 

Next year, we need to start Webb at once corner, pick up another via draft or free agency.

Keep Washington and Foxworth for nickel package or depth.

 

If Reed retires (from neck problems), we need to acquire 2 new safeties via draft or FA.

Keep Zib and Nak for depth.

 

While we are at it, we need a secondary coach who teaches tackling, cover skills and discipline. Wow, what a concept.

 

The good news: the secondary cant get much worse.

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Does anyone else think that Webb has #1 corner potential? He continued to impress last night as he played extensively on the outside for the first time in his career. Yeah, he got that pass interference penalty, but it was only a 7-yard penalty on a slant with Webb trying to make an aggressive play. Webb may give up a completion, but what impresses me is that he is always on the receiver's back pocket making the tackle as soon as the receiver catches the ball. None of that 20-yard cushion crap we see with Carr and Foxworth. I used to think Webb was probably a #2 at best, but I believe he can be a very good player in this league. With that said, we need to get a bigger corner to pair up with Webb.

 

Our technique in the secondary is absolutely pathetic. We have a culture of believing it is okay to wrestle with receivers 20-yards down field. We are not covering guys, we are shoving them. That is not how you play DB in this league. When you have a rookie from a DII school that is the only player that understands how to actually cover, that is sad. I don't think Foxworth is a lost cause, he would probably be a solid #3 corner, allowing Webb to move inside to play the slot on third downs (like how Foxworth was used in Atlanta, he wasn't depended on as a top corner). But as long as we do not have a #1 corner, Foxworth will be exposed. Carr, Walker, Landry, Zib, they can all leave for all I care.

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You guys should probably stop all the grand illusions of Foxworth playing the nickel right now. He costs too much to not be starting, so he will continue to start.

 

At least, that is, until our second round pick in 2010 starts outplaying him.

 

You are probably right. That would not neccessarily be a bad thing to have Foxworth as our #2 corner if we had a legit #1 corner. Webb is excellent in the slot, and doing so would allow him to stay on kick return duties. The fact remains that we need a #1 corner, preferably someone at least 6" or more. Carr, Zibby, Landry, and Walker are all pretty pathetic in coverage.

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Guest BallTMore
Does anyone else think that Webb has #1 corner potential?

 

I think he does. I loved seeing him torpedo at Grant during that one stretch play last night. He shows no fear. All our other guys over-run or try to trip the defender while pushing him to the ground. I used to do that when I was 11. Sad! And like you said, when he does give up a pass, he's right there to bring the defender down.

 

Frank Walker is just...Frank Walker. How long does it take to learn to turn around and look for the ball? As soon as the receiver looks for the ball he starts pushing and grabbing. In the huddle I would just say. "I'm throwing the ball to whomever 41 is covering." You're going to get the yards either way.

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Does anyone else think that Webb has #1 corner potential? He continued to impress last night as he played extensively on the outside for the first time in his career. Yeah, he got that pass interference penalty, but it was only a 7-yard penalty on a slant with Webb trying to make an aggressive play. Webb may give up a completion, but what impresses me is that he is always on the receiver's back pocket making the tackle as soon as the receiver catches the ball. None of that 20-yard cushion crap we see with Carr and Foxworth. I used to think Webb was probably a #2 at best, but I believe he can be a very good player in this league. With that said, we need to get a bigger corner to pair up with Webb.

 

Our technique in the secondary is absolutely pathetic. We have a culture of believing it is okay to wrestle with receivers 20-yards down field. We are not covering guys, we are shoving them. That is not how you play DB in this league. When you have a rookie from a DII school that is the only player that understands how to actually cover, that is sad. I don't think Foxworth is a lost cause, he would probably be a solid #3 corner, allowing Webb to move inside to play the slot on third downs (like how Foxworth was used in Atlanta, he wasn't depended on as a top corner). But as long as we do not have a #1 corner, Foxworth will be exposed. Carr, Walker, Landry, Zib, they can all leave for all I care.

 

 

TCleetz - Well put. Out pathetic technique and culture all goes back to coaching. Its not being taught or being followed through. Its been this way for the past several years since we lost our DB coach (I believe his name was Donnie Henderson ???).

 

If Harbs doesnt change this in the offseason, we are looking at this undisciplined play for several more years. God help us.

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What got me furious was that PI call against Landry. He ran down the field with his right arm holding Driver's arm, and Landry's left arm was up in the arm to show "hey, I am not touching him." It was absolutely pathetic, Landry could have pulled his arm out when he saw the ball was going to sail over his head, but he continued to hold Driver well after the play. It is like Landry knew he was going to get a penalty, and his reaction to covering it up was late.

 

This goes to your point VA, is it the coaches that are teaching the guys to play like this, or is it the skill level? I want to think it is the coaching and this is something that is correctable, then I see Webb out there playing with proper technique and the coaches are saying how Webb has come a long way with his technique since arriving and I am starting to think that either the rest of the bunch are just dumb and cannot apply what they are learning, or they do not have the skill to keep up in this league.

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What got me furious was that PI call against Landry. He ran down the field with his right arm holding Driver's arm, and Landry's left arm was up in the arm to show "hey, I am not touching him." It was absolutely pathetic, Landry could have pulled his arm out when he saw the ball was going to sail over his head, but he continued to hold Driver well after the play. It is like Landry knew he was going to get a penalty, and his reaction to covering it up was late.

 

This goes to your point VA, is it the coaches that are teaching the guys to play like this, or is it the skill level? I want to think it is the coaching and this is something that is correctable, then I see Webb out there playing with proper technique and the coaches are saying how Webb has come a long way with his technique since arriving and I am starting to think that either the rest of the bunch are just dumb and cannot apply what they are learning, or they do not have the skill to keep up in this league.

 

 

I wish I knew. I am just a fan trying to understand this team's problems.

Our secondary's problems seem to be related to 3 issues:

 


lack of focus, leadership, discipline and coaching


insufficient talent and/or injuries (Washington, Reed)


lack of consistent, pass rush

 

For the first issue, we have to change our coaching, leadership, culture and personnel. If not, we can expect the same results.

 

Second issue - we have to draft well and make up for last years missed opportunities for S and CB. Injuries are part of the game and we need some depth to step up. A physical, tall shutdwon CB, instead of our midget CBs, would help tremendously.

 

Third issue-like second issue, we've got to draft or acquire some legit pass rushers. Suggs, JJ and an aging Ray Ray aint going to cut it anymore. Jury is out on Ellerbe, Gooden and McClain. Maybe we arent coaching these guys either. Regardless, our opponents are killing Flacco, while our D doesnt seem to match the physicality, desire and intensity of our opposition.

Bottom line: we need to acquire, properly coach and motivate our pass rushers. We havent had a serious pass rushing force for 2-3 years.

 

We need help and it wont happen overnight.

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I wish I knew. I am just a fan trying to understand this team's problems.

Our secondary's problems seem to be related to 3 issues:

 


lack of focus, leadership, discipline and coaching


insufficient talent and/or injuries (Washington, Reed)


lack of consistent, pass rush

 

For the first issue, we have to change our coaching, leadership, culture and personnel. If not, we can expect the same results.

 

Second issue - we have to draft well and make up for last years missed opportunities for S and CB. Injuries are part of the game and we need some depth to step up. A physical, tall shutdwon CB, instead of our midget CBs, would help tremendously.

 

Third issue-like second issue, we've got to draft or acquire some legit pass rushers. Suggs, JJ and an aging Ray Ray aint going to cut it anymore. Jury is out on Ellerbe, Gooden and McClain. Maybe we arent coaching these guys either. Regardless, our opponents are killing Flacco, while our D doesnt seem to match the physicality, desire and intensity of our opposition.

Bottom line: we need to acquire, properly coach and motivate our pass rushers. We havent had a serious pass rushing force for 2-3 years.

 

We need help and it wont happen overnight.

 

I think the coaches have had enough with Gooden, Ellerbe was in there most of the night and looked really good against the run. He is still a little raw in the passing game, but he has the tools improve. The main thing is that he is not afraid to hit someone, which is the case with Gooden. McClain is probably a solid role player, fill-in starter. He has a place on this team, but I don't think he is a starter. I like what I saw from Antwan Barnes the other night, he needs to get more PT.

 

 

Ozzie certainly has his work cut out for him. He needs to start searching for a new playmaking safety, a Ray Lewis heir, a #1 corner, and some way to generate a pass rush. Remember this though, as bad as the defense looked last night, the had some key stops against the Packers in the first and third quarters. Our offense just killed us with turnovers and the inability to convert opportunities. Maybe if the offense gives the defense some points to work with, the defense is able to play with some confidence. I fully believe Ozzie will be able to shore this thing up, but in the NFL now-a-days the success of a defense is so much dependent upon what your offense can do.

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Guest BallTMore

Cmac was released today by the Saints. Should we pick him up?

 

I wouldn't mind, but I think he and Harbaugh have serious issues, so I don't think it will happen. McAlister's time in Baltimore is over.

 

Besides, our coaching staff would probably bench Webb instead of Foxworth or Carr to give McAlister PT.

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Something must be wrong with McAlister. If he still "had it" they wouldn't let him go.

 

vernon.jpg"Maybe they should tape the secondary's arms to their sides so they can't grab anybody."

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