A draft prediction

[cravnravn]

 

You're talking about Mario Pouncey of Florida, the least-hyped of the Pouncey Tripletts. Guy needs to fire his publisher.

 

 

Are you kidding me, theres another Pouncey out there?? dam, gotta be worth a play.

[SpearSrai]

 

 

Are you kidding me, theres another Pouncey out there?? dam, gotta be worth a play.

 

It was a joke Crav.

[cravnravn]

[papasmurfbell]

http://www.rotoworld.com/slide/nfl/215/NFL-Mock-Draft

 

29. Ravens - Wake Forest WR Chris Givens

 

It's no secret that Baltimore's offense sputtered in 2011 due to the receivers' continued struggles to create separation. Torrey Smith flashed improved route running down the stretch, but remains a project entering his second season. Anquan Boldin's game is eroding going on age 32, and Lee Evans will be an offseason roster bonus casualty. A likely Combine riser, Givens has drawn Antonio Brown comparisons as a dangerous downfield threat who beat out higher-profile wideouts like North Carolina's Dwight Jones for first-team All-ACC honors in 2011.

 

I just don't see this.

[SpearSrai]

http://www.rotoworld.../NFL-Mock-Draft

 

 

 

I just don't see this.

 

Yeah... that's ridiculous. And Antonio Brown was drafted in the sixth round, for what it's worth. And Torrey was a late second.

[Dunno]

http://www.rotoworld.../NFL-Mock-Draft

 

I just don't see this.

 

Me neither, haven't they tried these kinds of receivers before without success?

 

With Cam staying, what they need are 6-5 receivers who are open due to their sheer size...

[SpearSrai]

 

Me neither, haven't they tried these kinds of receivers before without success?

 

With Cam staying, what they need are 6-5 receivers who are open due to their sheer size...

 

Like Mohamed Sanu and Alshon Jeffery

[papasmurfbell]

I just don't see a WR as a need at all. Maybe draft one late for ST's but that's about it.

[SpearSrai]

I just don't see a WR as a need at all. Maybe draft one late for ST's but that's about it.

 

We had two rookies as part of our starting rotation last year, and the other guy is an aging veteran. And none of them is taller than 6'2. It's definitely a need... unless you're willing to say that LaQuan Williams, Lee Evans, and Tandon Doss are the superstar #1's that we're looking for when Boldin hangs it up.

[papasmurfbell]

Torrey could be that #1 in 2013. He was far better than I was expecting this yr. I thouhgt 2011 was going to be his remedial training. I do not see why he can't add 300 yds and 20 more catches to what he did this yr. I would put Williams on the other side. Q works the slot. Doss is Q's replacemant when it is time to cut ties. Evans will more than likely be elsewhere or he pushes down Williams if he takes a pay cut. For the first time ever they Ravens are raelly stocked at WR.

[SpearSrai]

Torrey could be that #1 in 2013. He was far better than I was expecting this yr. I thouhgt 2011 was going to be his remedial training. I do not see why he can't add 300 yds and 20 more catches to what he did this yr. I would put Williams on the other side. Q works the slot. Doss is Q's replacemant when it is time to cut ties. Evans will more than likely be elsewhere or he pushes down Williams if he takes a pay cut. For the first time ever they Ravens are raelly stocked at WR.

 

I haven't heard anyone looking at Torrey as a #1.... he's a prototypical 2 or 3. But a 1 is a superstar who can go up and take the ball out of the air... Torrey is a burner. Hope he's great. But he can't be the 1 guy you have.

[papasmurfbell]

There are very few of those super star great WR's. You have to be drafting quite high to get a guy like that most of the time. Smith is their #1.

[SpearSrai]

There are very few of those super star great WR's. You have to be drafting quite high to get a guy like that most of the time. Smith is their #1.

 

No you don't - those guys are late 1st/2nd round guys all the time. Hakeem nicks, 29th. Britt 30th. Even boldin was a 2nd. Brandon Marshall, Colston, mike wallace, steve smith, T.O., Ochocinco, desean Jackson, etc. Even dez Bryant fell to what, 24? And he was hyped!

 

Just saying. Receivers fall A LOT more than other positions.

 

there are tons of examples of this.

[papasmurfbell]

The Ravens are at 29. There are guys who fall but it is not all the time. Cruz was I think a 5th rounder. Exceptions are not the rule. Also the OL is in need of help. IF Joe is on his back he can't throw to a stud WR.

[SpearSrai]

The Ravens are at 29. There are guys who fall but it is not all the time. Cruz was I think a 5th rounder. Exceptions are not the rule. Also the OL is in need of help. IF Joe is on his back he can't throw to a stud WR.

 

With WR's it is. Receiver is one of the most undervalued position in the draft. Go look through the last decade of WR's and where they were picked. I broke it up by early first (19th overall or earlier), Mid (20-26), and Late (later than 27th) Don't worry too much about that part... I don't know why I did it that way.

 

2011:

Early: AJ Green, Julio Jones.

Mid: Jon Baldwin (26th)

Late: Torrey Smith

 

2010:

Early: None

Mid: Demaryius Thomas (22), Dez Bryant (24),

Late: Arrelious Benn, Golden Tate, Brandon LaFell, Damian Williams, Jordan Shipley, Eric Decker, Mike Williams, Jacoby Ford, Antonio Brown

 

2009:

Early: Darrius Heyward-Bey, Michael Crabtree

Mid: Jeremy Maclin, Percy Harvin

Late: Hakeem Nicks, Kenny Britt, Mike Wallace, Louis Murphy, Austin Collie, Julian Edelman

 

2008:

Early: No 1st round WR

Mid: No 1st round WR

Late: Jordy Nelson, Donnie Avery, Eddie Royal, Jerome Simpson, DeSean Jackson, Early Doucet, Harry Douglas, Andre Caldwell, Lavelle Hawkins, Josh Morgan, Pierre Garcon, Stevie Johnson

 

2007:

Early: Calvin Johnson, Ted Ginn Jr

Mid: Dwayne Bowe, Robert Meachem

Late: Sidney Rice, Steve Smith, Laurent Robinson, James Jones, Mike Sims-Walker, Steve Breaston

 

2006:

Early: None

Mid: Santonio Holmes (25)

Late: Greg Jennings, Brandon Marshall, Marques Colston

 

2005:

Early: Braylon Edwards, Troy Williamson, Mike Williams (USC)

Mid: Matt Jones, Mark Clayton

Late: Roddy White, Vincent Jackson

 

2004:

Early: Larry Fitzgerald, Roy Williams, Reggie Williams, Lee Evans, Michael Clayton

Mid: None

Late: Michael Jenkins, Devery Henderson, Jerricho Cotchery

 

2003:

Early: Charles Rogers, Andre Johnson, Bryant Johnson,

Mid: None

Late: Anquan Boldin, Nate Burleson, Brandon Lloyd

 

2002:

Early: Donte Stallworth, Ashlie Lelie

Mid: Javon Walker

Late: Antwaan Randel-El, Deion Branch

 

2001:

Early: Koren Robinson, Rod Gardner, Santana Moss

Mid: Freddie Mitchell (25)

Late: Reggie Wayne, Chad Johnson, Chris Chambers, Steve Smith, T.J. Houshmandzadeh

[papasmurfbell]

2011:

Early: AJ Green, Julio Jones.

Mid: Jon Baldwin (26th) - Not a #1. He is a possession type of guy.

Late: Torrey Smith

 

2010:

Early: None

Mid: Demaryius Thomas (22), Dez Bryant (24),

Late: Arrelious Benn, - Not a #1 type.

Golden Tate, - I think he will fail. Not #1 type.

Brandon LaFell, I see him sort like Laquan Williams.

Damian Williams, - Sort of like Evans. Not a league #1 but can be a teams #1.

Jordan Shipley, - Qucik over the middle possession WR.

Eric Decker, - Possession WR.

Mike Williams, - Williams like WR.

Jacoby Ford, Sort of like Evans.

Antonio Brown - Not even close to a #1.

 

2009:

Early: Darrius Heyward-Bey, Michael Crabtree - It looks like niether of them will be #1's.

Mid: Jeremy Maclin, - Not a #1.

Percy Harvin - Not a #1.

Late: Hakeem Nicks, - He is a #1. He was my favorite WR in that draft.

Kenny Britt, - Not #1.

Mike Wallace, He might end up being a #1.

Louis Murphy, Not by a long shot.

Austin Collie, Not even close.

Julian Edelman - Not even close.

 

2008:

Early: No 1st round WR

Mid: No 1st round WR

Late: Jordy Nelson, Not a #1

Donnie Avery, Not a #1

Eddie Royal, Not a #1

Jerome Simpson, Not a #1

DeSean Jackson, If not for him being an A-hole he would have been drafted much earlier.

Early Doucet, Not #1

Harry Douglas, Not #1

Andre Caldwell, Not #1

Lavelle Hawkins, Not #1

Josh Morgan, Not #1

Pierre Garcon, Not #1

Stevie Johnson The Bills #1

 

2007:

Early: Calvin Johnson,

Ted Ginn Jr Not #1

Mid: Dwayne Bowe, #1 tweener.

Robert Meachem Not #1

Late: Sidney Rice, Not #1

Steve Smith, Not #1

Laurent Robinson, Not #1

James Jones, Not #1

Mike Sims-Walker, Not #1

Steve Breaston Not #1

 

2006:

Early: None

Mid: Santonio Holmes (25)

Late: Greg Jennings,

Brandon Marshall, If not for being a head case he would be a #1.

Marques Colston Not #1

 

2005:

Early: Braylon Edwards, Not #1

Troy Williamson, Not #1

Mike Williams (USC) Not #1

Mid: Matt Jones, Not #1

Mark Clayton Is this one a joke?

Late: Roddy White, Vincent Jackson

 

2004:

Early: Larry Fitzgerald, Roy Williams, Reggie Williams,

Lee Evans, Not #1

Michael Clayton Not #1

Mid: None

Late: Michael Jenkins, Not #1

Devery Henderson, Not #1

Jerricho Cotchery Not #1

 

2003:

Early: Charles Rogers, Not #1

Andre Johnson,

Bryant Johnson, Not #1

Mid: None

Late: Anquan Boldin,

Nate Burleson, Not #1

Brandon Lloyd Not #1

 

2002:

Early: Donte Stallworth,

Ashlie Lelie Not #1

Mid: Javon Walker Not #1

Late: Antwaan Randel-El, Not #1

Deion Branch Not #1

 

2001:

Early: Koren Robinson, Not #1

Rod Gardner, Not #1

Santana Moss Not #1

Mid: Freddie Mitchell (25) Not #1

Late: Reggie Wayne,

Chad Johnson,

Chris Chambers, Not #1

Steve Smith,

T.J. Houshmandzadeh Not #1

[SpearSrai]

Kenny Britt is definitely #1. DeSean was underdrafted because he weighed 165 lbs and played receiver, not (just) because of his attitude. Plenty of jerks get drafted high.

 

Lee Evans was a #1 in Buffalo...he could be that guy... he had an injury-plagued guy...not sure about that one.

 

For the record, I wasn't saying all of those guys are #1's...just showing all of the receivers who have had some measure of success, and where they were drafted. It's not one of those "the top guys are usually first rounders" positions, at all. Tons of first-round busts and late successes, as you can see.

[papasmurfbell]

http://www.footballnation.com/content/desean-jackson-big-plays-and-big-attitude/10938/

There is no doubt that DeSean Jackson is a talent and has incredible ability but the one thing that has followed Jackson around even in college is the attitude. At times it seems that Jackson goes all out on the field but there are times where is effort is questioned. Jackson has never been touted as a great teammate or even a team player, granted he has made strides since college but it has once again reared it ugly head.

 

With the benching of Jackson on Sunday this is not the first time there has been issues inside the Eagles locker room. Let’s remember he is in the final year of his rookie contract but let’s also remember that his production is tremendously down from last season. Jackson has never had a lack of confidence in himself or his ability and I understand that missing a meeting is not the beginning of the end but for the Eagles, when the season is already hitting rocky times do you really need this type of behavior from your top receiver?

 

 

His attitude is what allowed him to be underdrafted.

[SpearSrai]

http://www.footballnation.com/content/desean-jackson-big-plays-and-big-attitude/10938/

 

 

His attitude is what allowed him to be underdrafted.

 

Mid-to-late first maybe.. but second round? Definitely his size and durability were the bigger concerns. Still are, actually.

[papasmurfbell]

He still has the I will try when I want to or Randy Mossitis. He is a spoiled child.

[SpearSrai]

He still has the I will try when I want to or Randy Mossitis. He is a spoiled child.

 

And I'd take either of those guys (in their prime) because when they're "trying", they're unstoppable.

 

Jackson's punt return against the Giants last year? Incredible.

[papasmurfbell]

That is not the point you were making before. I am saying he was underdrafted because his attitude sucked. You were saying it was his size. Many teams would take him. The question is when will they take him? It is about risk reward benefit. The later they drafted him the cheaper he was so if he acts like an ass then you can let him sit and not care. There is a reason why the Eagles didn't give him a new deal. They don't trust him with lots of cash.

[papasmurfbell]

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/02/15/mayock-vontaze-burfict-is-not-a-first-round-player-at-all/

 

</h2>

<h2 class="h1 entry-title"> Mayock: Vontaze Burfict is not a first-round player “at all”

 

Arizona State linebacker Vontaze Burfict appeared to be trending toward a future top-ten draft prospect when he was voted first-team All-American as a true sophomore. Burfict wasn’t even honored as an All-Pac 12 pick as a junior, however, and his production slipped mightily across the board.

NFL Network’s Mike Mayock has watched Burfict’s games. And he isn’t impressed.

“I’m not a fan at all,” Mayock said of Burfict on Wednesday’s conference call with the media. “I just watched a bunch of his tape the other day. I came away unimpressed.”

Burfict has been criticized for off-field issues as well as his on-field self control, committing a high number of personal foul penalties. Mayock said he tried to filter out Burfict’s off- and on-field character when breaking down the player.

“His instincts aren’t good,” Mayock added. “He gets enveloped by bigger bodies and he runs around blocks. … For a big, strong guy, he’s nowhere near as strong at the point of attack as I thought he’d be.

“I don’t see first round at all.”

 

Now maybe if he really falls the Ravens could trade back 5-6 spots get this guy anyway and also some more picks.

[SpearSrai]

http://profootballta...-player-at-all/

 

</h2>

 

 

Now maybe if he really falls the Ravens could trade back 5-6 spots get this guy anyway and also some more picks.

 

That, or will decide he isn't even worth a pick in the first 3 rounds because he can't read an offense to save his life and consistently gets in fights on and off the field, in practice and around campus.

 

And this is coming from a guy who has him as his profile icon.

[SpearSrai]

That is not the point you were making before. I am saying he was underdrafted because his attitude sucked. You were saying it was his size. Many teams would take him. The question is when will they take him? It is about risk reward benefit. The later they drafted him the cheaper he was so if he acts like an ass then you can let him sit and not care. There is a reason why the Eagles didn't give him a new deal. They don't trust him with lots of cash.

 

And my original point is that, regardless of which circumstances, receivers often fall much further down the draft than they would based on talent alone. Receivers have been falling further and further the past 5 years, with the number drafted in the first 3 rounds declining every season.