News and Notes from Camp via PFF

[colincac]

Some good stuff from PFF as usual.

 

https://www.profootballfocus.com/blog/2013/08/06/neils-nfl-daily-august-6-2013/

[vmax]

It's good to get some information on Shipley and Spears.

I feel better about the center position and figured Spears was average because I've heard very little about him. It looks like Spears will be in the run rotation...giving players a rest.

There's 4 pre season games to play so the cream will rise to the top.

 

I'm not worried about Elam. Ihedibo has experience and he has developed well. Communication and knowing the defense and the offenses of the NFL is a must at safety. Elam has a lot to learn.

[RavenMad]

I wish they had put their depth chart at the start of the article. I would have lol'ed and then stopped reading as it's a pile of crap especially the player type chart.

 

Lets see, for starters Joe is only listed as above average. We can argue to death whether Joe is elite but what's not up for argument is whether he is in the top tier of QBs so that alone should have him listed in the High Quality category.

 

Elvis Dumervil is listed as average! Alright then. Toke, toke, pass. Give me some.

 

Michael Oher is not a below average RT. Below Average LT yes, but not at RT.

 

Onto the article. If they have ever paid attention to the John Harbaugh era at all, they will know that he does not throw rookies into the starting lineup early. They must earn their starting role on the practice field, in scrimmages and then in preseason games. If they don't add that caveat about the roles of rookies then talking about this and that veteran starting ahead of them is wasted print.

 

By the way, I think that is a great philosophy by John. Rookies will have to work hard to earn their roles and veterans at least know they will only lose their job to someone playing better than them, rather than some early round draft pick just being handed the spot because of where they were drafted

[colincac]

I wish they had put their depth chart at the start of the article. I would have lol'ed and then stopped reading as it's a pile of crap especially the player type chart.

 

Lets see, for starters Joe is only listed as above average. We can argue to death whether Joe is elite but what's not up for argument is whether he is in the top tier of QBs so that alone should have him listed in the High Quality category.

 

Elvis Dumervil is listed as average! Alright then. Toke, toke, pass. Give me some.

 

Michael Oher is not a below average RT. Below Average LT yes, but not at RT.

 

Onto the article. If they have ever paid attention to the John Harbaugh era at all, they will know that he does not throw rookies into the starting lineup early. They must earn their starting role on the practice field, in scrimmages and then in preseason games. If they don't add that caveat about the roles of rookies then talking about this and that veteran starting ahead of them is wasted print.

 

By the way, I think that is a great philosophy by John. Rookies will have to work hard to earn their roles and veterans at least know they will only lose their job to someone playing better than them, rather than some early round draft pick just being handed the spot because of where they were drafted

PFF only lists about 5 players per position as 'Elite'. Joe is nowhere near the Top 5 and thus their ranking is more than fair.

 

Dumervil actually didn't have a great season last year, but in their first Depth Chart they stated that should he return to his play from 2-4 years ago, our Defensive Line would be one of the best.

 

Oher doesn't have good pass-blocking metrics and also is a penalty magnet.

 

They simply state that it is surprising the rookies aren't starting yet, as anyone on this board could say we all figured Brown and Elam would get thrown into the fire because of the lack of depth we had at their positions. Right now I can understand Brown not starting as we've added depth at MLB, but Elam should be impressing over a journeyman.

[RavenMad]

PFF only lists about 5 players per position as 'Elite'. Joe is nowhere near the Top 5 and thus their ranking is more than fair.

 

Dumervil actually didn't have a great season last year, but in their first Depth Chart they stated that should he return to his play from 2-4 years ago, our Defensive Line would be one of the best.

 

Oher doesn't have good pass-blocking metrics and also is a penalty magnet.

 

They simply state that it is surprising the rookies aren't starting yet, as anyone on this board could say we all figured Brown and Elam would get thrown into the fire because of the lack of depth we had at their positions. Right now I can understand Brown not starting as we've added depth at MLB, but Elam should be impressing over a journeyman.

1. They don't even consider Joe in the High Quality category so their ratings are bullshit. Joe had the greatest playoff run in the history of the NFL. Not elite? Debatable. Not High Quality = nonsense.

 

2. Dumervils bad season is still greater than most players good seasons so he should at least be above average.

 

3. Oher at RT is a different beast to Oher at LT like I stated. He has above average athleticism for the RT spot with an Elite mean streak.

 

4. Not surprising when you consider John's past like I said. I still expect them to start on opening day as they develop through preseason.

[colincac]

1. They don't even consider Joe in the High Quality category so their ratings are bullshit. Joe had the greatest playoff run in the history of the NFL. Not elite? Debatable. Not High Quality = nonsense.

 

2. Dumervils bad season is still greater than most players good seasons so he should at least be above average.

 

3. Oher at RT is a different beast to Oher at LT like I stated. He has above average athleticism for the RT spot with an Elite mean streak.

 

4. Not surprising when you consider John's past like I said. I still expect them to start on opening day as they develop through preseason.

Flacco was rated 25th in QBR last year( http://espn.go.com/nfl/qbr ) Anyone doing statistical analysis doesn't throw the large sample size out the window, and moving Flacco from 25 to somewhere in the middle of the pack because of his playoff run is more than fair... unless you're a homer.

 

You watched probably 2 games of Dumervil and I find your attempt to argue with a flat statistical analysis of his performance absolutely hilarious.

 

Oher's rating is for his play last year, which was obviously mostly at LT. I agree he is better as a RT.

[Money]

Flacco was rated 25th in QBR last year( http://espn.go.com/nfl/qbr ) Anyone doing statistical analysis doesn't throw the large sample size out the window, and moving Flacco from 25 to somewhere in the middle of the pack because of his playoff run is more than fair... unless you're a homer.

 

You watched probably 2 games of Dumervil and I find your attempt to argue with a flat statistical analysis of his performance absolutely hilarious.

 

Oher's rating is for his play last year, which was obviously mostly at LT. I agree he is better as a RT.

 

1. I don't believe you should ever evaluate QBs based solely off their stats, but using QBR is especially ridiculous. QBR is a flat out joke.

 

2. If I was GM of the Ravens, there are only two QBs I would trade Joe for right now. Those two are Aaron Rodgers and Andrew Luck.

[colincac]

 

1. I don't believe you should ever evaluate QBs based solely off their stats, but using QBR is especially ridiculous. QBR is a flat out joke.

 

2. If I was GM of the Ravens, there are only two QBs I would trade Joe for right now. Those two are Aaron Rodgers and Andrew Luck.

Answers like this are why I sometimes think part of this board is clinically insane. Considering his contract, there are probably only about 5 teams that WOULD trade for Joe. Do you realize that?

[vmax]

About 20 teams would give their left nut for Joe.

[cravnravn]

20?? Id say 30

[vmax]

The addition of Joe would turn a lot of teams into playoff teams. His loss to Baltimore would mean years of not making the playoffs.

If the Cowboys or Houston got him they'd be Super Bowl favorites. Joe can do what their QB's can't...win in the playoffs.

If Miami gets him they win the division. They'd pay anything for Joe.

Chicago...playoffs!

The Bucs would rise from the ashes. Same for the Bills.

Need I say Browns....they might make a wild card but definitely be the best team in the North if they got some receivers for Joe next year. What do you pay for that?

He could take the Bengals to the Super Bowl. What do you pay for that?

KC...wow....

Jets and Philly...problems solved.

How about the Vikings? Joe and Adrian....

[cravnravn]

How about Pitt, Cincy & Cleveland..They'd be contenders, maybe not Pitt they didnt improve the o0line

[RavenMad]

Flacco was rated 25th in QBR last year( http://espn.go.com/nfl/qbr ) Anyone doing statistical analysis doesn't throw the large sample size out the window, and moving Flacco from 25 to somewhere in the middle of the pack because of his playoff run is more than fair... unless you're a homer.

 

You watched probably 2 games of Dumervil and I find your attempt to argue with a flat statistical analysis of his performance absolutely hilarious.

 

Oher's rating is for his play last year, which was obviously mostly at LT. I agree he is better as a RT.

1. Flacco had Cam Cameron as a lead weight around his waist for most of the season. Hence the lol QBR rating.

 

2. Dumervil had 11 sacks in a "down" season. That was tied for 14th in the league! That would be arguing the point based upon flat statistical data which is no less than what you have done with saying Joe Flacco is middle of the pack with his lolQBR rating.

 

3. I agree with your agreement that Oher is a better RT.

[Money]

Answers like this are why I sometimes think part of this board is clinically insane. Considering his contract, there are probably only about 5 teams that WOULD trade for Joe. Do you realize that?

 

Name a QB other than the two I mentioned who you would rather have. Forget about Brady, Peyton and Brees...nobody would trade the number of years left with Joe for the number of years any of those three have left. Ben? You would need to do something with the giant fork sticking out of his body. Ryan? He's accomplished far less than Joe and actually makes more money. RG3? Maybe I can see that, but what a risk. I really like him (but I also really liked Vick). Kaep or RW? Sorry, they need to prove a whole lot more. Eli? The dude is clutch, but so is Joe (and Joe has the higher ceiling).

[oldcrow]

 

Name a QB other than the two I mentioned who you would rather have. Forget about Brady, Peyton and Brees...nobody would trade the number of years left with Joe for the number of years any of those three have left. Ben? You would need to do something with the giant fork sticking out of his body. Ryan? He's accomplished far less than Joe and actually makes more money. RG3? Maybe I can see that, but what a risk. I really like him (but I also really liked Vick). Kaep or RW? Sorry, they need to prove a whole lot more. Eli? The dude is clutch, but so is Joe (and Joe has the higher ceiling).

LOL

joe only has a higher ceiling because he is taller

 

ELI HAS 2 RINGS lil joey one LOL

ONE and a bigger contract that actually the ravens DO NOT AND WILL NOT HONOR

[colincac]

PLEASE consider CAP CONSTRAINTS when blindly claiming that teams would 'Give their left nut' for Joe Flacco. There are very few teams who would pay what we just did for Joe Flacco, and in a cap-contrained world, what you make is JUST as important as what you do.

[Money]

Every team without a franchise QB would pay what the Ravens paid for Flacco. Dallas and Atlanta paid more for QBs who have accomplished less. Seattle, SF and DC will roll with their QBs under their rookie contracts just like the Ravens did with Joe. If they continue being successful, they will then sign those QBs to monster contracts.

 

St. Louis gave a guy who hadn't played a down in the the NFL a $78mil contract in their quest for a franchise QB.

[oldcrow]

PLEASE consider CAP CONSTRAINTS when blindly claiming that teams would 'Give their left nut' for Joe Flacco. There are very few teams who would pay what we just did for Joe Flacco, and in a cap-contrained world, what you make is JUST as important as what you do.

ravens will not honor the contract because lil joey won't fulfill plain and simple

[Money]

ravens will not honor the contract because lil joey won't fulfill plain and simple

 

"Joe Flacco will never win a Super Bowl in this lifetime" - LaMarr Woodley

[colincac]

Every team without a franchise QB would pay what the Ravens paid for Flacco. Dallas and Atlanta paid more for QBs who have accomplished less. Seattle, SF and DC will roll with their QBs under their rookie contracts just like the Ravens did with Joe. If they continue being successful, they will then sign those QBs to monster contracts.

 

St. Louis gave a guy who hadn't played a down in the the NFL a $78mil contract in their quest for a franchise QB.

St. Louis was forced to do that by the CBA and the rookie contract scale. That is the absolute worst example you could have possibly brought up.

 

Flacco is actually getting paid only $600,000 less than Ryan over the course of the deal. Ryan does have superior stats, but he also has had Roddy White and Green, so I side with you on that argument. Romo is getting paid a few million less per year, a significant amount, albeit with superior regular season performance to Flacco.

[Money]

St. Louis was forced to do that by the CBA and the rookie contract scale. That is the absolute worst example you could have possibly brought up.

 

Flacco is actually getting paid only $600,000 less than Ryan over the course of the deal. Ryan does have superior stats, but he also has had Roddy White and Green, so I side with you on that argument. Romo is getting paid a few million less per year, a significant amount, albeit with superior regular season performance to Flacco.

 

I'm talking about what teams will risk financially to land a franchise QB. Bradford is actually the best example. BTW...St. Louis wasn't forced to draft Bradford.

 

When looking at the QB deals, guaranteed money is the only thing that counts. Romo's and Ryan's deals dwarf Flacco's with guaranteed money.

 

Stop talking about stats. Flacco played the bulk of his first 5 years under Cam Cameron and in the AFC North. He also plays the bulk of his games outdoors. Comparing him statistically to Matt Ryan (for an example) is like comparing apples to oranges. Ryan's stats would be no better (and probably worse) than Flacco's if Ryan was in the same situation. I love fantasy football, but I swear people have lost touch with many realities of the game.

[oldcrow]

Ryan looks a heck of a lot better than joe

marketability makes you more money

 

that's why Ryan is a household name without winning it all

 

 

 

 

 

YET

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

see Anna Kournikova

[Money]

I'm sorry...who looks better?

 

 

 

[oldcrow]

I'm sorry...who looks better?

 

 

 

GOTTA GO #2

 

 

WAIT

 

WHAT?

[cravnravn]

GOTTA GO #2

 

 

WAIT

 

WHAT?

 

 

For what??? Ryan cant carry Joes jock during the playoffs, you know when games count..

 

Joe 9 playoff wins

 

Matty Melt ONE playoff win.

 

Yet you'd take Matty Melt.*shakes head

Edited August 8, 2013 by cravnravn