tsylvester Posted March 17, 2014 Posted March 17, 2014 See how easy it is? I hope the next guy helps us to a SB in his first 5 yrs off his rookie contract. I hope he's better too but mostly I hope we get a SB in the next 5yrs Oh please, Kip Vickers could have helped this team wina Super Bowl two seasons ago, does that mean he was good? No, Oher was drafted to be a left tackle, but he did not put the work in needed, just as Gaither. So they bounced him to the right tackle in hopes that would 1) spure him on to put more effort into his training and 2) solidy the line. Neither happened. On talent alone you saw how "good" he was, with more effort he has the tools needed to be excellant. That is not just my opinion and no I do not rank players based on what a TEAM did..... Quote
Money Posted March 17, 2014 Posted March 17, 2014 Oh please, Kip Vickers could have helped this team wina Super Bowl two seasons ago, does that mean he was good? No, Oher was drafted to be a left tackle, but he did not put the work in needed, just as Gaither. So they bounced him to the right tackle in hopes that would 1) spure him on to put more effort into his training and 2) solidy the line. Neither happened. On talent alone you saw how "good" he was, with more effort he has the tools needed to be excellant. That is not just my opinion and no I do not rank players based on what a TEAM did..... Comparing Oher to a POS like Gaither is over the top. 1 Quote
RavenousBG Posted March 17, 2014 Posted March 17, 2014 Oh please, Kip Vickers could have helped this team wina Super Bowl two seasons ago, does that mean he was good? No, Oher was drafted to be a left tackle, but he did not put the work in needed, just as Gaither. So they bounced him to the right tackle in hopes that would 1) spure him on to put more effort into his training and 2) solidy the line. Neither happened. On talent alone you saw how "good" he was, with more effort he has the tools needed to be excellant. That is not just my opinion and no I do not rank players based on what a TEAM did.....Aaahhh but he didn't did he? Oher did. It's on you to go half empty over half full. But out of the time he was here, we were in the playoffs 80% of the time. It seems that we did well with him most of the time. I'm not saying he was great or anything but piling on the guy after mostly success is a bit much to me. Some act as if he's the main reason we were mediocre last yr. he had a bad yr. I can accept that. Stop the hate, congratulate and move on. Positive vibes bring positive results. I save my vitriol for other teams mostly. If we get rid of a guy, why pepper him with insults while he's going out the door? Now if we play the titans....have at it. Oher has done some good work for us. He wasn't a train wreck the whole time or a locker room cancer. Quote
RavenousBG Posted March 17, 2014 Posted March 17, 2014 I beg to differ about which tackle position he was best suited for. There were questions when he came out. Actually I remember questions about his intelligence and whether he was an LT at the NFL level. I think he's a RT with some LT ability. But you, tsylvester, gave Oher a compliment too by believing that he's talented enough to be a good LT but just hasn't put the work in. His quickness is there but he gets penalized for it often so I see him as RT. I think he could excellent there. Quote
tsylvester Posted March 17, 2014 Posted March 17, 2014 Pepper him with insults just because he left? I was never infavor of drafting him, didn't like his attitude in college, thought it would carry over, guess it did. You can pin the wins on him all you want, all you are doing though, is doing exactly what you claim I, and others are doing to him, only in reverse. He was not the reason they won, nor is the reason they lost last year. My point always was and will be, he was over hyped, has not realized his potential, largely because he has a bad work ethic, Why get so defensive about the guy, I now ask you? I never said which tackle he was better suited for, only that thereason the team drafted him was for the left side. Yes his quickness is there, but without proper direction, it is good for nothing. Yes, he can get to the 2nd level, but is almost always off target/out of position and misses those blocks. He has no strength, reason why he cannot move anyone off the LOS, why? Because he does not put the proper work in the weight. These were the same questions that surrounded him coming out of college, but the Ravens took a chance on him, just as they took a chance, albeit much, much smaller, on Gaither. I am only comparing the two in regaurds to their work ethic, not in the types of people they are. 1 Quote
vmax Posted March 17, 2014 Posted March 17, 2014 I like Oher but he definitely underachieved and last season he flat out disappeared. The Ravens will have 3...maybe 4 comp picks.... The Ravens have lost three free agents – Oher, Corey Graham and Art Jones – and have signed only one free agent from another team in Smith. But Smith won’t count against the compensatory pick formula because he was cut.So, depending on how much the former Ravens play next season (among other factors), the Ravens are expected to be at plus-3 comp picks. The most you can get is four, and James Ihedigbo could be signing with Detroit to boost the Ravens to plus-four. Quote
Oldschool739 Posted March 17, 2014 Posted March 17, 2014 BG, I gotta agree with sly on this one.....We're not saying he is worthless, just not that good.....Let me ask you this; do you think he is worth the 4 yr 20 mil that Tenn just gave him and would you have wanted Ozzie to resign him for that amount ?..... Quote
RavenousBG Posted March 17, 2014 Posted March 17, 2014 Gentlemen, I never said I thought he was good. I said we won with him. I said he wasn't the cause of our collapse last season. I said I thought we should let him walk away and not crap on him. He didn't live up to expectations. But facts are facts and results are results. He was part of a team that went to consecutive AFCCs and a SB winner. You can spin a all you like but face that. Now if we get a guy that we are satisfied with but we don't win anything then we will be upset because we didn't get the ultimate goal. I'm okay with Oher. I'm okay with us letting him go and yes , with the market, the Titans paid too much but they may have thought they had to. They may think he still has unrealized potential. I don't know but I still appreciate the guy fighting his ass off as best he could to help us get that Lombardi. That's a fact . I'm a Soldier and I know that makes me passionate. There's Soldiers that aren't as good as others but I appreciate all that I've commanded. That's how I feel my friends. Oher wasn't what we envisioned but we got to the top with. You can't overlook that most important result. Quote
RavenousBG Posted March 17, 2014 Posted March 17, 2014 Pepper him with insults just because he left? I was never infavor of drafting him, didn't like his attitude in college, thought it would carry over, guess it did. You can pin the wins on him all you want, all you are doing though, is doing exactly what you claim I, and others are doing to him, only in reverse. He was not the reason they won, nor is the reason they lost last year. My point always was and will be, he was over hyped, has not realized his potential, largely because he has a bad work ethic, Why get so defensive about the guy, I now ask you? I never said which tackle he was better suited for, only that thereason the team drafted him was for the left side. Yes his quickness is there, but without proper direction, it is good for nothing. Yes, he can get to the 2nd level, but is almost always off target/out of position and misses those blocks. He has no strength, reason why he cannot move anyone off the LOS, why? Because he does not put the proper work in the weight. These were the same questions that surrounded him coming out of college, but the Ravens took a chance on him, just as they took a chance, albeit much, much smaller, on Gaither. I am only comparing the two in regaurds to their work ethic, not in the types of people they are.Not the reason they won, one of 53 reasons. They made up a team. Quote
Oldschool739 Posted March 17, 2014 Posted March 17, 2014 Not the reason they won, one of 53 reasons. They made up a team.But so was Fat Mac, and you know he was a slouch.....Don't you think it is also possible that we won in spite of his deficiencies just as much as the opposite ?.....You know how I respect our soldiers, but you can't compare a guy that is playing a game for millions of dollars to his benefit to a soldier that is fighting for pride, freedom and being paid peanuts to risk his life in doing so.....Does not compute 1 Quote
RavenousBG Posted March 17, 2014 Posted March 17, 2014 But so was Fat Mac, and you know he was a slouch.....Don't you think it is also possible that we won in spite of his deficiencies just as much as the opposite ?.....You know how I respect our soldiers, but you can't compare a guy that is playing a game for millions of dollars to his benefit to a soldier that is fighting for pride, freedom and being paid peanuts to risk his life in doing so.....Does not compute Just the team concept School, that's all. Soldiers and athletes aren't the same. I know. Lol! Don't misunderstand me my friend. I'm 17 yrs deep into my career. But the team concept is very similar. As far as Mac, I haven't said anything about him either. He played well to get us that SB too. To win in spite would imply that you couldn't run to Oher's side and that he gave olay blocks whenever Joe dropped back to pass and tipped off play action every time they lined up. It would imply the Ravens tried to replace him because he was so bad. It wasn't in spite of or despite him that we won. But see what you like. I see it differently. Oher never lived up to expectation but he helped our team become champions. Quote
Oldschool739 Posted March 18, 2014 Posted March 18, 2014 Just the team concept School, that's all. Soldiers and athletes aren't the same. I know. Lol! Don't misunderstand me my friend. I'm 17 yrs deep into my career. But the team concept is very similar. As far as Mac, I haven't said anything about him either. He played well to get us that SB too. To win in spite would imply that you couldn't run to Oher's side and that he gave olay blocks whenever Joe dropped back to pass and tipped off play action every time they lined up. It would imply the Ravens tried to replace him because he was so bad. It wasn't in spite of or despite him that we won. But see what you like. I see it differently. Oher never lived up to expectation but he helped our team become champions.Ok soldier, what do we do to replace him now ? Sign a FA, address it in the draft, scoot KO over there and address the blind side ?What do you think Ozzie will do, just an educated guess of course !! Quote
RavenousBG Posted March 18, 2014 Posted March 18, 2014 Ok soldier, what do we do to replace him now ? Sign a FA, address it in the draft, scoot KO over there and address the blind side ?What do you think Ozzie will do, just an educated guess of course !!I hope they don't move KO. Winston is a short term answer. I'm curious about Wagner. So I think it will be a combo of guys on the roster and a draft pick competing for that RT spot. I'm in favor of it. Maybe someone will emerge. But I think KO will be great where he is and if we get Mack then we will be solid on the line. Quote
RavenousBG Posted March 18, 2014 Posted March 18, 2014 Ok soldier, what do we do to replace him now ? Sign a FA, address it in the draft, scoot KO over there and address the blind side ?What do you think Ozzie will do, just an educated guess of course !!I hope they don't move KO. Winston is a short term answer. I'm curious about Wagner. So I think it will be a combo of guys on the roster and a draft pick competing for that RT spot. I'm in favor of it. Maybe someone will emerge. But I think KO will be great where he is and if we get Mack then we will be solid on the line. Quote
RavenousBG Posted March 18, 2014 Posted March 18, 2014 Ok soldier, what do we do to replace him now ? Sign a FA, address it in the draft, scoot KO over there and address the blind side ?What do you think Ozzie will do, just an educated guess of course !!I hope they don't move KO. Winston is a short term answer. I'm curious about Wagner. So I think it will be a combo of guys on the roster and a draft pick competing for that RT spot. I'm in favor of it. Maybe someone will emerge. But I think KO will be great where he is and if we get Mack then we will be solid on the line. Quote
RavenousBG Posted March 18, 2014 Posted March 18, 2014 Ok soldier, what do we do to replace him now ? Sign a FA, address it in the draft, scoot KO over there and address the blind side ?What do you think Ozzie will do, just an educated guess of course !!I hope they don't move KO. Winston is a short term answer. I'm curious about Wagner. So I think it will be a combo of guys on the roster and a draft pick competing for that RT spot. I'm in favor of it. Maybe someone will emerge. But I think KO will be great where he is and if we get Mack then we will be solid on the line. Quote
cravnravn Posted March 18, 2014 Posted March 18, 2014 I hope they don't move KO. Winston is a short term answer. I'm curious about Wagner. So I think it will be a combo of guys on the roster and a draft pick competing for that RT spot. I'm in favor of it. Maybe someone will emerge. But I think KO will be great where he is and if we get Mack then we will be solid on the line.I don't think we'll be able to land Mack, Cleveland designated him as the franchise player, so it will take a hefty offer from Ozzie to land him. Quote
Robjr83 Posted March 18, 2014 Author Posted March 18, 2014 I don't think we'll be able to land Mack, Cleveland designated him as the franchise player, so it will take a hefty offer from Ozzie to land him. Cle has more cap space too so if they wanted to they could match any offer. His price is just a little too sweet for my taste. They might need to pickup a serviceable vet till Wagner or someone better comes available. We need more depth in general along the line. Gino might not have been as bad if Sh!tley didn't beat out Jah Reid for KO's spot. Quote
RavenousBG Posted March 18, 2014 Posted March 18, 2014 If we can't get Mack then we will be drafting a center also. That's a less than ideal answer. I'm cool with a young guy at RT but less so with issues at center. However, we are all down on Gino.....well he may be the best answer in the end. I hope Gino is in the weight room proving everyone wrong. I hope we go into the season with 4 proven commodities on the Oline. If Gino is going to be the center, then Winston may be the move. Quote
Oldschool739 Posted March 18, 2014 Posted March 18, 2014 I don't think we'll be able to land Mack, Cleveland designated him as the franchise player, so it will take a hefty offer from Ozzie to land him.Correct !!!!! "As a result, the still cap-rich Browns would likely match the offer, unless it grossly overpays Mack even more than his $10 million transition tender would pay on a one-year deal.That said, there are ways to ensure that Mack would make it to the open market in 2015, if a team would be interested in pursuing him then. For example, Mack could be signed to an offer sheet that pays him $10 or more for 2014, with an enormous option bonus or roster bonus due on the first day of the 2015 league year. If the Browns were to match the deal, they’d have to cut Mack before, for example, $50 million is owed in March of next year.The offer sheet also could consist of a one-year deal with a commitment to not use the franchise or transition tag in 2015. This would ensure that Mack hits the open market next year.Any team that signs Mack to an offer sheet like that risks creating the perception that it’s not happy with the current starting center or that it anticipates pursuing a new center in 2015. There’s also a risk that the freedom the team helps finagle will blow up on that team next year, if Mack signs with another team in the same division.Regardless, Mack’s best play would be to sign the transition tender before the Browns realize that they’re offering to pay $10 million for one year to a center and rescind the offer. If no offer is going to come from another team, Mack needs to realize that, if the tender is yanked in April, May, or June, the money on the open market won’t be anywhere close to $10 million per year." http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2014/03/18/alex-mack-still-getting-no-interest/ Quote
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