papasmurfbell Posted July 30, 2014 Posted July 30, 2014 It will be amazing to watch this blow up in Peter's face. A 30 yr old pitcher gets off one roster and will be saddled to a div rival. Then Boston will get a young arm to torch the O's with for yrs. Quote
ForceEight Posted July 30, 2014 Posted July 30, 2014 And Lester will be back there in six months anyway...I hope it's not true. Quote
ForceEight Posted July 30, 2014 Posted July 30, 2014 Curious as to where you're hearing it from. I don't see so much as a rumor of a deal posted anywhere. Quote
GrubberRaven Posted July 30, 2014 Posted July 30, 2014 It's all over twitter, but nothing is confirmed. Only way I see it getting done is if Lester agrees to a new deal and we drop Bundy. Quote
GrubberRaven Posted July 30, 2014 Posted July 30, 2014 (edited) Annnnd he's in uniform as we speak. (Boston uniform ) Edited July 30, 2014 by GrubberRaven Quote
papasmurfbell Posted July 30, 2014 Author Posted July 30, 2014 Curious as to where you're hearing it from. I don't see so much as a rumor of a deal posted anywhere.https://www.facebook.com/ken.weinman/posts/10152587334369717?comment_id=10152587559969717&offset=0&total_comments=34¬if_t=feed_comment_replyhttps://www.facebook.com/groups/747699828608180/802429019801927/?notif_t=group_comment_reply Quote
ForceEight Posted July 30, 2014 Posted July 30, 2014 http://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/2014/07/30/there-are-reports-that-jon-lester-is-going-to-the-orioles-and-reports-that-thats-utter-baloney/ Quote
thundercleetz Posted July 31, 2014 Posted July 31, 2014 It will be amazing to watch this blow up in Peter's face. A 30 yr old pitcher gets off one roster and will be saddled to a div rival. Then Boston will get a young arm to torch the O's with for yrs. It's a no win for us. We trade them and they flourish for someone else, or we keep them an they blow out their arms. Quote
dc. Posted July 31, 2014 Posted July 31, 2014 Depends who we give up. Gausman, Harvey, Bundy - no way. But any of our second tier guys - sure. I mean, it's not a huge win for us and I doubt he will sign with us, but the odds that so many of our really young guys become what we envision... slim to none. Not sure why the Red Sox are asking so much (maybe in the end they won't). Lester has practically promised to come back if they make a fair offer and almost anything in a trade will be better than a compensatory pick. What do they have to lose? Quote
papasmurfbell Posted July 31, 2014 Author Posted July 31, 2014 So you have to hold onto as many as possible to increase the odds that you have a real gem. Quote
dc. Posted July 31, 2014 Posted July 31, 2014 So you have to hold onto as many as possible to increase the odds that you have a real gem. Yeah - but you also have to play the odds sometimes. Not only is it unlikely that so many of those second tier guys will ever pan out, but even if they do, the odds of being a "real gem" are almost nothing. The teams you tout, Papa, don't find "gems" that just pop up out of no where - they've seen them coming for years. I'm not putting stock in much of our farm system if we haven't heard their names in legit top prospect conversations yet. Quote
Spen Posted July 31, 2014 Posted July 31, 2014 Cool so if Peter does this (im pretending to know like others claim to know that Peter makes all the calls) then it's going to blow up and be stupid and I'm sure if he does nothing it would be proof he doesn't want to win. Fun stuff. Quote
thundercleetz Posted July 31, 2014 Posted July 31, 2014 So you have to hold onto as many as possible to increase the odds that you have a real gem.Yeah because holding Rocky Coppinger, Matt Riley, Hayden Penn, Daniel Cabrera, Brian Matusz, Jake Artieta (before he flamed out), Adam Loewen, and many other "top" prospects worked so well. Luckily we could salvage Zach Britton's career but that looked extremely bleak up until this season. I am not saying you are wrong in theory, I am saying I have no confidence in the Orioles developing a stud pitcher. No way I trade Gausman, looks like we managed not to mess him up. But Harvey and Bundy, especially with their arm issues, I'd absolutely be open to trading them. Quote
dc. Posted July 31, 2014 Posted July 31, 2014 Yeah because holding Rocky Coppinger, Matt Riley, Hayden Penn, Daniel Cabrera, Brian Matusz, Jake Artieta (before he flamed out), Adam Loewen, and many other "top" prospects worked so well. Luckily we could salvage Zach Britton's career but that looked extremely bleak up until this season. I am not saying you are wrong in theory, I am saying I have no confidence in the Orioles developing a stud pitcher. No way I trade Gausman, looks like we managed not to mess him up. But Harvey and Bundy, especially with their arm issues, I'd absolutely be open to trading them. I'm not moving Bundy. No way. And Harvey is now out for the year, so I doubt he's on the table. But some of those guys like Rodriguez we hear about 'on the farm'.... they were never meant to be anything anyway, they just happen to be decent suddenly. Doubting they ever turn it up. I will say on the other side, though, that most of the guys you mention came through our system when it was at it's absolute worst - not just in terms of who the prospects were, but also in terms of the organization of our coaching. Showalter has been focused on that issue especially - trying to bring our lower level teams into line teaching and building the right skills so that guys are actually major league ready. Most say he's been fairly successful and Duquette and some other additions (like our new pitching coach, name is escaping me) have helped because they have been "organization" guys in the past, not just coaches and top level. Quote
papasmurfbell Posted July 31, 2014 Author Posted July 31, 2014 Yeah - but you also have to play the odds sometimes. Not only is it unlikely that so many of those second tier guys will ever pan out, but even if they do, the odds of being a "real gem" are almost nothing. The teams you tout, Papa, don't find "gems" that just pop up out of no where - they've seen them coming for years. I'm not putting stock in much of our farm system if we haven't heard their names in legit top prospect conversations yet.And we have not seen it with Bundy and Gausman? Harvy was doing pretty well before getting hurt. These are the type of guys that were being talked about. I also heard Schoop which doesn't make sense either. The kid really could be the all star mainstay at 2nd. Yeah because holding Rocky Coppinger, Matt Riley, Hayden Penn, Daniel Cabrera, Brian Matusz, Jake Artieta (before he flamed out), Adam Loewen, and many other "top" prospects worked so well. Luckily we could salvage Zach Britton's career but that looked extremely bleak up until this season. I am not saying you are wrong in theory, I am saying I have no confidence in the Orioles developing a stud pitcher. No way I trade Gausman, looks like we managed not to mess him up. But Harvey and Bundy, especially with their arm issues, I'd absolutely be open to trading them. I will say on the other side, though, that most of the guys you mention came through our system when it was at it's absolute worst - not just in terms of who the prospects were, but also in terms of the organization of our coaching. Showalter has been focused on that issue especially - trying to bring our lower level teams into line teaching and building the right skills so that guys are actually major league ready. Most say he's been fairly successful and Duquette and some other additions (like our new pitching coach, name is escaping me) have helped because they have been "organization" guys in the past, not just coaches and top level.Exactly what I was going to say. This has not been a single GM and scouting dept over all this time. Andy and Dan have both been on the same page. They need to stay on that direction. Quote
cravnravn Posted July 31, 2014 Posted July 31, 2014 According to the Boston paper, they want Gausman or Bundy or Gonzalez since he started with the Sox minor leagues..Gonzo yes, the other 2 no way in hell Quote
varaven45 Posted July 31, 2014 Posted July 31, 2014 Agree with Crav on offers. Only Gonzo; throw in Flaherty or a "home run" Hunter Quote
papasmurfbell Posted July 31, 2014 Author Posted July 31, 2014 The A's are all in. I wonder if this is also for them to try to pry a new stadium out of the area. Quote
GrubberRaven Posted July 31, 2014 Posted July 31, 2014 They're sick and Cespedes more often against us...yikes. We seem to do well against Lester, so I was sad to see him go. Glad we didn't trade the farm. Quote
ForceEight Posted July 31, 2014 Posted July 31, 2014 What a sickening trade. The A's are selling everything they have for starting pitching. Quote
GrubberRaven Posted July 31, 2014 Posted July 31, 2014 I'll never understand that way of thinking. Quote
dc. Posted July 31, 2014 Posted July 31, 2014 Deal surprises me. It's going to hurt the A's in the long-run. First, they are trading a serious bat. I wonder how their line-up functions without him. Not to mention the defensive hit they will take. I already mentioned how I thought their bats were overperforming - maybe this will hurt. Their arms of course are going to be outstanding. But they won't be able to keep Lester or Samardizja beyond this year - maybe one, but I doubt it. I guess it could be all in for this year, but I am not convinced they can do it without the bats! Quote
papasmurfbell Posted July 31, 2014 Author Posted July 31, 2014 I think in the long term they are trying to push for a new stadium. Quote
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