dc. Posted November 7, 2015 Posted November 7, 2015 You go the draft and find a cheaper younger alternative. Bingo. Joe was overpaid. He was paid huge money on one thing wins. If you look more closely at his stats he was less intrinsic to those wins than many want to believe. He was riding a running game and a solid D. He won most of the time when his skills were used the least. Joe is a game mang and $120 is way to much for a game mang. No you just make the conscious decision not to chase the idiot owners down the rabbit hole. Younger, cheaper... Equally as effective? Draft pick wasted on a position we already have secured instead one of dozens we need help with? And the math still doesn't add up to me. We'd save so little money in the next two years of this contract by cutting him... That we actually couldn't add anything except a rookie draft pick to replace him. So at best, we are helped in the years? Why not just wait to cut him until then since the money is give anyway? If he were truly unproductive it would be one thing... Quote
papasmurfbell Posted November 7, 2015 Posted November 7, 2015 If Joe doesn't renegotiate then it is a position that is not secured. It would be a full rebuild so you would be using the time to clean the cap as well. Quote
dc. Posted November 7, 2015 Posted November 7, 2015 I just mean, if the net gain is 3m ... Why cut him now? Next year the net gain is more like 16m... Quote
cravnravn Posted November 7, 2015 Posted November 7, 2015 If Joe doesn't renegotiate then it is a position that is not secured. It would be a full rebuild so you would be using the time to clean the cap as well.What gives you any feeling that Joe won't negotiate? With the junk we have at wr, Joe is putting numbers up, and the defense was solely responsible for 4 of our losses. Quote
papasmurfbell Posted November 7, 2015 Posted November 7, 2015 I just mean, if the net gain is 3m ... Why cut him now? Next year the net gain is more like 16m...Because if they decide to keep him then they will have to find 10+ players on the roster to get under the cap. Then in 2017 they will have to do that again. It would be Joe and a bunch of slap nuts. What gives you any feeling that Joe won't negotiate? With the junk we have at wr, Joe is putting numbers up, and the defense was solely responsible for 4 of our losses.So I am wondering who is wearing #5 here.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xkRHdHZpN_Ehttp://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-game-highlights/0ap3000000439714/Flacco-intercepted-in-the-endzonehttp://www.raiders.com/media-vault/videos/Ravens-Joe-Flacco-intercepted-by-Raiders-Neiko-Thorpe/718f4d1b-1d18-4cec-979b-a4a4b5ab60d1 Quote
dc. Posted November 7, 2015 Posted November 7, 2015 How many players would we have to find next year if we cut him? 11 with an extra 3m? Quote
papasmurfbell Posted November 7, 2015 Posted November 7, 2015 But it is dealing with the problem one time. If you wait for 2017 then you have to deal with the problem twice. Quote
oldno82 Posted November 7, 2015 Posted November 7, 2015 But the whole concept of dead money is that you're still committing the call money to the player... They just don't play for you.Yes, I know but we'd still save significant cap room. 20-24% would be Joe's share of the cap in 2016 and 2017. The dead money is ugly but the escalating cap hits are uglier. Like I said, I like Joe and would like him to stay here but only with a reasonable cap hit. Quote
papasmurfbell Posted November 7, 2015 Posted November 7, 2015 Really not only does Joe need to rework his deal he should take a pay cut. That is the only way he shoudl stay. He has proven he can't carry the team and should adjust his pay to be just a cog. Quote
oldno82 Posted November 7, 2015 Posted November 7, 2015 I just mean, if the net gain is 3m ... Why cut him now? Next year the net gain is more like 16m...dc, that's a reasonable question. Maybe it would be better to wait one more year. But at some point we'd still have to bite a big bullet. What really bothers me is Joe's agent. I think Linta's a real a--hole after the comments he made after the new mega-deal was signed. He showed no class. I really don't think Joe would mind restructuring but I get the feeling this guy Linta will do everything in his power to maintain the status quo. It might be the Ngata situation all over again but with bigger long term implications. Quote
dc. Posted November 7, 2015 Posted November 7, 2015 Again, I'm not against a restructure at all. I'm just saying the do or die right now I'd nonsense because the numbers don't work yet - at least next year our leverage would be the cap hit to cutting him is a significant discount. As for Linta - the comments were crass but I need more context. Was he responding to a question that warranted a response? Quote
papasmurfbell Posted November 7, 2015 Posted November 7, 2015 I remember him making them. He was gloating that he beat the Ravens. He sought out the media to make the comment. Quote
cravnravn Posted November 7, 2015 Posted November 7, 2015 dc, that's a reasonable question. Maybe it would be better to wait one more year. But at some point we'd still have to bite a big bullet. What really bothers me is Joe's agent. I think Linta's a real a--hole after the comments he made after the new mega-deal was signed. He showed no class. I really don't think Joe would mind restructuring but I get the feeling this guy Linta will do everything in his power to maintain the status quo. It might be the Ngata situation all over again but with bigger long term implications.I don't, he knew, Joe knew, Bisquit knew, Oz knew when the deal was signed it was only a 3 year deal. Agents might be assholes but they know if their client makes money they make money. Quote
papasmurfbell Posted November 7, 2015 Posted November 7, 2015 And for that 3 yrs the Ravens are a below .500 team. Tells me that the contract was not good for the team. Quote
cravnravn Posted November 8, 2015 Posted November 8, 2015 And for that 3 yrs the Ravens are a below .500 team. Tells me that the contract was not good for the team.We were in the playoffs 1 out of the 2 years, 3rds not complete yet Quote
papasmurfbell Posted November 8, 2015 Posted November 8, 2015 If you believe the Ravens make th ePO's this yr I have a bridge to sell. Quote
dc. Posted November 8, 2015 Posted November 8, 2015 And for that 3 yrs the Ravens are a below .500 team. Tells me that the contract was not good for the team.Given the contract hardly affected the team for its first two years, maybe that's premature? 2013 in particular, what exactly did Joe's contract and relatively small cap hit, relative both to later years and consummerate pay for other strong QBs, have to do with Ray Rice's 2.9ypc? Quote
dc. Posted November 8, 2015 Posted November 8, 2015 I remember him making them. He was gloating that he beat the Ravens. He sought out the media to make the comment.You remember wrong. Comments were post 2013 season when some were blaming contract for deals that sent Boldin away among others. Linta was defending Joe and the contract against that. Didn't sound like he was seeking anyone out except defending his client, his work, etc against claims made against them http://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/nfl/ravens/2013/05/26/joe-flacco-contract-never-seen-a-dumber-move-joe-linta/2361599/ Quote
oldno82 Posted November 8, 2015 Posted November 8, 2015 Bottom line is that we'll all find out for sure at the end of this season or next if he takes a restructured contract. I hope he does but I sure don't feel certain. Quote
papasmurfbell Posted November 8, 2015 Posted November 8, 2015 Given the contract hardly affected the team for its first two years, maybe that's premature? 2013 in particular, what exactly did Joe's contract and relatively small cap hit, relative both to later years and consummerate pay for other strong QBs, have to do with Ray Rice's 2.9ypc?All in all it is turning out to be a bad deal. You remember wrong. Comments were post 2013 season when some were blaming contract for deals that sent Boldin away among others. Linta was defending Joe and the contract against that. Didn't sound like he was seeking anyone out except defending his client, his work, etc against claims made against them http://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/nfl/ravens/2013/05/26/joe-flacco-contract-never-seen-a-dumber-move-joe-linta/2361599/I do remember him making a comment about how stupid the team was to not make a deal earlier. Quote
dc. Posted November 8, 2015 Posted November 8, 2015 Find it. And find the context. And if he truly went out of his way to much the team fine. I'll say, wow you were right. But those words, "oh sorry, I was wrong" can be a suitable replacement at any time. Quote
papasmurfbell Posted November 8, 2015 Posted November 8, 2015 Find it. And find the context. And if he truly went out of his way to much the team fine. I'll say, wow you were right. But those words, "oh sorry, I was wrong" can be a suitable replacement at any time.http://baltimore.cbslocal.com/2013/05/28/joe-linta-agent-for-joe-flacco-defends-his-comments-about-ravens-front-office/ Quote
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