SpearSrai Posted February 17, 2012 Posted February 17, 2012 Oh come on. You guys are something else. Flacco over Eli? Flacco over Romo? And to think there I have been accused of being a homer at times... that's a whole different level of homerism. No one would take Flacco over Eli or Romo or any of those other guys. Heck, no one would take Flacco over Cam Newton. Quote
ForceEight Posted February 17, 2012 Posted February 17, 2012 Flacco is good, and he is starter-worthy, but he is not elite, he is not great, and he is certainly not a top five QB. If you can sign him to something reflecting his value, then you do it. If he won't take less than a top five-type (or even top eight or nine-type) contract, you let him hit the open market in 2013 and realize his own value. There's a very solid chance that he does realize where he stands and comes back, but there's almost as good a chance of a QB-starved team giving him one of those big contracts. Either way, the Ravens make a smarter business decision. Flacco is replaceable. Will it be easy? No. But is he worth enough to this team and franchise to pay that much money? Absolutely not. He's not even the franchise's face on that side of the ball. In fact, there may be two or three players on offense more valuable than him. Quote
cravnravn Posted February 18, 2012 Author Posted February 18, 2012 Better than Unitas, even, AMIRIGHT? I said it two years ago, theres something in Joes demeanor that reminds me so much of #19, Dont know if you seen Johnny play, but noone questioned Johnny's lack of rah-rah during games, Johnny went out there and did his job, Just as Joes doing..And Im sure Johnny would agree, Joe does have better arm strength, but is still a tad behind on field smarts..Will Joe be the general that Johnny was? stay tuned.. Quote
cravnravn Posted February 18, 2012 Author Posted February 18, 2012 Yo force....Flacco is replaceable? with who..Im sorry but Brady is getting old and is under contract, Rogers is under contract..Pig Pen hes just a bull in a glass shop, hes damaged goods. Dont even say Luck or RGIII Quote
vmax Posted February 18, 2012 Posted February 18, 2012 I didn't say Flacco was better than Eli but now that I think about it he could end up doing just as well. Eli got his 1st Super Bowl off that fluke/spectacular Tyree catch. Joe is one dropped ball away from his 1st Super Bowl. If that catch is made and Joe goes on to beat the Giants then we are having a whole different conversation.I absolutely think Joe can lead a team to more wins than Romo....and he's proven that with a weaker cast of receivers than Romo has. Quote
papasmurfbell Posted February 18, 2012 Posted February 18, 2012 Everyone is replaceable. I didn't say Joe was better than Eli. I said Eli has been better with the right parts around him. I have said that Joes OL has been substandard since he has been here. He has had lacking WR's since he has been here for the most part. I think Joe would shine in NY. One he would be away from CAM. Two he would have those weopons and a very solid OL. Quote
SpearSrai Posted February 18, 2012 Posted February 18, 2012 We can't know for sure where to place all the blame... there's just as much of a chance that Flacco is making his receivers look bad as that they're making him look bad. Every team has drops, but guys like Brady and Manning consistently make mediocre-to-bad receiving talent look like pro bowlers. Torrey Smith and LaQuan Williams? Manning had Garcon and Collie. And there was a year when Brady's #1 receiver was Jabar Gaffney and he still threw for 4400 yds and 28 TD - without ever having a running game like we do. It's Cam's fault, it's Joe's fault and it's the receivers' fault. And you could always argue that one creates the other, but we really have no idea. Quote
vmax Posted February 18, 2012 Posted February 18, 2012 It's Cam's fault, it's Joe's fault and it's the receivers' fault. And you could always argue that one creates the other, but we really have no idea. I think you're on to something there Spear.We really have no idea but you just violated board rules.. ....this admission is not supposed to be posted publicly or admitted by anyone. Week after week we pick apart the line, Cam, Joe, the receivers...all those aspects that stand in the way of this offense firing on all cylinders (except for that beautiful opening day ass kicking of the Steelers...let's pause for another toast!)......all those things that revolve around Joe's status amoung NFL QB's and his future. Well...with all these areas that are potential factors that keep this offense from breaking out...maybe...because they keep winning, with another year together and a few tweaks, 2012 is The Year. Is Joe the guy?Can the Ravens go to the Promised Land with him? I think so.Ravens management thinks so.His team mates think so....they know more than us...probably... Quote
vmax Posted February 18, 2012 Posted February 18, 2012 Here's more on this raging debate...http://www.baltimoreravens.com/?homepage=true Quote
cravnravn Posted February 19, 2012 Author Posted February 19, 2012 Is Joe the guy?Can the Ravens go to the Promised Land with him? IS A 40 pound worm fat? Quote
vmax Posted February 19, 2012 Posted February 19, 2012 From John Eisenberg... The agent for Ravens quarterback Joe Flacco expects his client to sign a major contract extension sometime in 2012. “I think it will happen,” Joe Linta said Friday during an appearance on Pro Football Talk Live. “Whether it happens now, in August or on St. Patrick’s Day, I can’t tell you.” Linta said he is comfortable with Ravens owner Steve Bisciotti, GM Ozzie Newsome and the team’s salary cap specialist, Pat Moriarty, which helps. “I know those guys really well. I’ve known them for years,” said Linta, who also represents Ravens center Matt Birk among other NFL players. “I’m not going to tell you we go to each other’s parties, but we’re very friendly with each other, very respectful.” Linta will spend most of his time negotiating with Moriarty. “We’re friends. This is obviously an important situation, but he’s got a job to do, I’ve got a job to do, and I think we’ll find some common ground,” Linta said. “It’s just a question of finding that common ground, what’s comfortable for the owner, for Ozzie and for Pat, and then what’s comfortable for our side.”http://www.csnbaltimore.com/blog/ravens-talk/post/Flaccos-agent-Ravens-deal-in-respect?blockID=653234&feedID=6703 Eisenberg has done a great job this year covering the Ravens. It's great to have a solid writer and journalist like him on the beat. There are a lot of reporters who cover the Ravens who I think don't know anymore than we do, but John's not one of them. The read between the lines has been for some time now that the Ravens will sign Joe and franchise Rice. Rice being the odd man out when he is arguably the key man on this offense.......so here we go with the rumors....the "according to a League Source" rumors... All is calm in Houston, but the situation in Baltimore is more uncertain. A league source told ProFootballTalk.com the two sides haven't made any progress in talks. NFL Network insider Jason La Canfora took that one step further Thursday, reporting via league sources that there haven't been any real talks between the player and team. League sources told La Canfora that Rice will be unhappy and won't rush to sign the franchise tag if the Ravens opt to use it without negotiating a potential long-term deal first.http://www.nfl.com/news/story/09000d5d82706092/article/foster-rice-in-different-places-as-franchise-tag-looms?module=HP11_hot_topics Quote
SpearSrai Posted February 19, 2012 Posted February 19, 2012 You think we'll overpay to keep Flacco specifically because of how much we've struggled over the years to find a better-than-average quarterback? There was a stretch there where we were going through 2 or 3 quarterbacks a season... and Flacco hasn't missed a game in his 4 years. This may be worth an extra few million a year, specifically because of our organization's history. Just a thought. Quote
yagersports Posted February 20, 2012 Posted February 20, 2012 Everyone is replaceable.........agreed. However it took us 10 freakin years just to find Joe in the first place. I'd rather not take another 10. How quickly people forget things. Quote
SpearSrai Posted February 20, 2012 Posted February 20, 2012 Everyone is replaceable.........agreed. However it took us 10 freakin years just to find Joe in the first place. I'd rather not take another 10. How quickly people forget things. It wasn't acceptable during that 10 year stretch, either. The organization took a ton of heat for its inability to find a halfway decent QB... we had McNair for one semi-quality season, but that was at the end of his career... we let the one consistent guy (Dilfer) walk after winning a ring... Joe is good, but he hasn't shown the type of flash that guys like Rodgers, Brees, Brady, etc. did early in their career. 4 years is a decent sample size - and while our TEAM has put together a ton of wins, you can't say right now that Joe looks like the kind of guy who will become a superstar. Quote
yagersports Posted February 20, 2012 Posted February 20, 2012 It wasn't acceptable during that 10 year stretch, either. The organization took a ton of heat for its inability to find a halfway decent QB... we had McNair for one semi-quality season, but that was at the end of his career... we let the one consistent guy (Dilfer) walk after winning a ring... Joe is good, but he hasn't shown the type of flash that guys like Rodgers, Brees, Brady, etc. did early in their career. 4 years is a decent sample size - and while our TEAM has put together a ton of wins, you can't say right now that Joe looks like the kind of guy who will become a superstar. But it's not so easy finding a QB is the point. If it was, everyone would have one. It's very difficult to find a good QB and now we have one. I'm not letting him go. Quote
SpearSrai Posted February 20, 2012 Posted February 20, 2012 But it's not so easy finding a QB is the point. If it was, everyone would have one. It's very difficult to find a good QB and now we have one. I'm not letting him go. I don't disagree with you... it's just the principle of the matter, if we're talking about overpaying a guy. I'm sure we won't have to overpay for him... Ozzie and Co. just have to convince him that he needs to use escalator clauses to obtain top 5 money. Quote
RavenMad Posted February 20, 2012 Posted February 20, 2012 At this moment in time Joe is not a top 5 guy so shouldn't be paid like one. However, if he believes he is and thinks he can prove it then there is absolutely no reason he couldn't take a contract along the lines of those being handed out to 2nd tier QBs like Kolb and Fitzpatrick got this last season but with the added incentives that if earned turn the contract into a top 5 QB contract. I don't think any of us or anyone in the Ravens front office would have any trouble forking over 20mill a season if we are winning superbowls and our QB looks like an All Pro. If Joe thinks he is worth Manning, Brees or Brady money at this point then he is deluded. Quote
vmax Posted February 21, 2012 Posted February 21, 2012 Joe's a tight wad. He got his Mom a lawnmower with his signing bonus....no shit. He won't be hard to please...and his agent won't like that. Quote
SpearSrai Posted February 21, 2012 Posted February 21, 2012 Correct. We know Joe feels underappreciated in the media, but I doubt he thinks he's earned top 5 money (and I don't think he's said as much, either.) We're mostly reacting to what his agent said - with both he, and with Rice. Quote
papasmurfbell Posted February 21, 2012 Posted February 21, 2012 Everyone is replaceable.........agreed. However it took us 10 freakin years just to find Joe in the first place. I'd rather not take another 10. How quickly people forget things. The problem with that is Ozzie became affraid of drafting the position. Like he was scared of going WR. He let Brian talk him into getting the wrong player. From that day he was scared for what 7 yrs to go back to the well. Quote
SpearSrai Posted February 21, 2012 Posted February 21, 2012 The problem with that is Ozzie became affraid of drafting the position. Like he was scared of going WR. He let Brian talk him into getting the wrong player. From that day he was scared for what 7 yrs to go back to the well. From what I understand, the guy Ozzie wanted was Byron Leftwich... also the wrong player. Quote
papasmurfbell Posted February 21, 2012 Posted February 21, 2012 True but Byron was taken before he could get him. Brian convinced him to give up a 2nd round pick that turned out to be Asante Samuels and a 1st round pick that turned into Wilfork. After giving up so much he seemed scared of the position. Quote
yagersports Posted February 21, 2012 Posted February 21, 2012 Ozzie isn't scared of drafting any position. How ridiculous. Quote
papasmurfbell Posted February 21, 2012 Posted February 21, 2012 It was said here about WR's for how long? Quote
yagersports Posted February 21, 2012 Posted February 21, 2012 I think Ozzie drafts the players that he believes will make an impact. He's gone after plenty of WRs. He's struck out a bunch, however I don't think that makes him afraid. Guys like Oz just aren't afraid of stuff like that. Why would he? He's done unbelievably well in so many other positions. No GM is perfect. I'm sure he knows that. With the addition of Flacco and now Smith, he may finally have drafted someone good at every position. It's good to be a Ravens fan. Quote
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