Ongoing Orioles thread.....

[varaven45]

DC;

 

Agree on 1. Yanks are playing awful but it was a AL East rival and in front of 45 k fans.

 

The bullpen.JJ. Strope. Whomever. Is frightening and tough to watch. Say what you will, but its the biggest difference from last year. Plus, Our team ERA is nearly 5 runs; only Houston has a worse ERA.

[vmax]

dc....you should get a signature photo of a chair on fire with Buck's name on it....

[dc.]

VA - I'm not disagreeing that the pen is struggling a bit ... but I am just laughing (kindly) that you're saying "Hunter may be the answer." The rollercoaster from year to year of our pen, and every pen in the league, is proof that there is no "answer." Our pen, meanwhile, is still very strong compared to most around the league.

 

Max - Am I being compared to someone??? If anything, I believe the opposite. I believe this team is great and in good shape - some weaknesses, yes, but very solid. I have few worries. I am loving life as an O's fan. But if you were to follow this thread, you'd think this team was fluctuating from being 5 games under to 5 games over each week... not that it was consistently over 500, in 2nd place and leading the league in runs, slugging, defense and close to the best in pen pitching!

[varaven45]

 

My point; we have a very good team that, like all teams. has weaknesses. Here's a decent article on ours and how we might get better.

O's must trade for a starter Baltimore will waste an elite offense unless it improves pitching

Updated: July 1, 2013, 1:12 PM ET

By Paul Swydan | ESPN Insider

 

On a macro level, the Orioles have been fairly consistent this season. They've won at least 15 games in each month of the season, and their standing in the ESPN Power Rankings has been fairly well clustered. They have been ranked no higher than No. 4 and no lower than No. 13. Fresh off a sweep of the rival Yankees, they rank seventh this week, but that ranking might be their ceiling if they are unable to improve their starting pitching.

 

It's hard to know who's in and who's out on a daily basis, given how many pitchers the O's have shuffled through. Ten different pitchers have started games for Baltimore this season. Of them, only three -- Wei-Yin Chen, Miguel Gonzalez and Chris Tillman -- have pitched well enough to retain their starting spot as we move into the second half. The bottom line is that their starting rotation -- which ranks 28th in FIP- -- is not getting the job done.

 

Jason Hammel was the talk of the town in the first half of last season, but a knee injury killed his momentum, and he hasn't been the same since. He has tossed a quality start just 44 percent of the time this season, which is a below-average rate. With a significant drop in both his strikeout rate and ground ball percentage, he is seeing a lot more hard-hit balls fly off opponents' bats. When everything is firing on all cylinders for Hammel, he is a solid No. 3 starter, but that is definitely not the case this season.

 

There are a number of unpalatable options to go with Hammel. Zach Britton, who has a higher walk rate than strikeout rate, Jake Arrieta (6.46 BB/9), Steve Johnson (on the 15-day disabled list) and Tsuyoshi Wada, who was so bad during his rehab from Tommy John surgery (8.14 ERA in six outings) that the team out righted him to Triple-A. None of them should be trusted moving forward.

 

Then there are the two guys who pitched Friday, phenom Kevin Gausman and success story T.J. McFarland.

 

Gausman clearly has the tools, and with a .337 batting average on balls in play as well as a very high 21.2 percent HR/FB ratio, you could make the argument that he has been unlucky in his initial showings. However, he's far from a sure thing for 2013. McFarland, a Rule 5 pick from the Indians last winter, is even less of a sure thing.

 

Point is, if the O's want to make sure they don't waste one of the best lineups in baseball, a rotation upgrade is in order.

[cravnravn]

You know what, this is Bucks 3rd year, he has pushed this team to play great baseball in august & September. recall when he was named manager, the O's were the winningest team Aug & Sept, we were just so far in the cellar, it went unnoticed.

 

The O's are right there, caus the break is just around the corner

[varaven45]

Good points, Crav. Bucks got em playing well, even with a makeshift pitching staff. Still, after watching them get so close last year, imagine how a shrewd move or two with the pitching staff might improve our chances to get over the top.

With our current lot, I don't know that will happen.

 

As an aside, I've watched the Os for six decades, from the 66' championship, through the glory days of the 70's, including the '70 championship, and the last championship in '83. Since the last great years (96-97), and aside from last year, I have labored through a long drought of pathetic, hopeless and last place seasons. I'd like to see this team take the next step and not just have a winning season and make the playoffs. To take the next step, we need improvement in our pitching staff.

 

I am trusting the O's FO will make a Ravens' Ozzie Newsome type move, make this happen and position this team for a championship run.

[cravnravn]

July 2 2012 the O's were 42-37, 6 games out of first, this year we are 11 games over .500 at this same date, and to thin we just went thru our mini-slump.

[varaven45]

Bats asleep in Chi-town. Maybe they wake up in NY. Sure could use some offense !

[cravnravn]

I'm chewing my nails

[varaven45]

Nice blown save Johnson ! Guy looks done. He's not the same pitcher this season.

[ForceEight]

Sure he is! Last year was more of an aberration than anything. He is a risky guy to have as a closer; look at how many saves he blew early in his career before we gave him the job. He's not the best closer around, and games like this prove it. The fact that he does save as many as he does, though, suggests that he's worth the pain.

 

I don't think we should expect a win with three hits in a game, regardless of whether there's a chance for a save.

[cravnravn]

Johnson needs to be sent to Richmond and needs his mechanics tuned up, He is totally out of wack, from his fielding and pitching motions.

 

Buck should have stuck with O'day

[oldcrow]

WHO HAS THE BEST RECORD?

 

THAT'S WHAT I THOUGHT.

[cravnravn]

Oh Jesus, who follows the JV National League?

 

Anyone?

 

Bueller?

 

Bueller?

[oldcrow]

SAVE FERRIS!

 

 

SAVE FERRIS!!!!

[cravnravn]

Are you down here? Yesterday was pretty cool, dam crowded too

[varaven45]

Crav,

 

I think you meant Norfolk ( rather than Richmond). It may not matter. The guy needs a change of scenery and Buck needs to adjust his bullpen, before we fall further behind Boston. This team ought to be right there but half a dozen blown saves (or so) is really takin it's toll.

[dc.]

VA - why does every guy who's having a rough time need a change of scenery? I hate that cliched response to everything.

 

Your buddy Tommy Hunter had a better game on Thursday, right... wait... no.

 

JJ is having control issues. But there is no easy solution. If you trade every guy when struggling, you'll be selling low and selling a lot and wind up in a dump. What do you think we get for JJ at present?

 

Meanwhile, Buck is mostly right - regardless of who gives up the runs - how many games are we expected to win when we score 2 runs on 3 hits? A decent study of baseball stats tells you it hardly matters who is closing (again, unless you've got Rivera)... it doesn't matter who's pitching most of the innings. You will lose the vast majority of games when you only score two runs.

[varaven45]

DC- not every guy- just JJ. He's human and having a bad stretch. Something needs to give - either we let JJ pitch through it or we adjust. It's tough- no easy answers or choices but adjustments are needed before we fall out of the race.

[dc.]

Just JJ... except... it was the same answer for Strop, right? And historically has been the same answer for anyone struggling. And will continue to be the gut reaction for anyone moving forward.

 

Who do you replaced JJ with? Not just as "closer" (which, yes, I agree we could more successfully go to a "committee" style), but in the bullpen in general? You think you can just find another arm to get the outs we need from this bullpen? I don't - not without sacrificing a decent starting arm into a reliever.

 

And I still wonder what you think we do with JJ? Can't send him down - he'd go to waivers and get picked up. So, trade him? Well, how much do you get for a guy at the low point of his career? Do you even get the same value in a relief pitcher? Probably not.

 

And you just said it - a bad stretch. Not a bad pitcher. A bad stretch.

 

Best option: have faith in your players, but change some strategy. He doesn't have to get every last three outs.

[dc.]

Would be nice, by the way, if he didn't have to come in literally every other game. He's only on pace for 80+ appearances this year. That's totally healthy and makes it possible to "reset" when you get, you know, a day's rest.

 

You don't even want to give the guy up to the All-Star break, a few days off, to see what comes of it?

 

You think anyone could put up with that much of a schedule? You're seeing Darren O'Day struggle because he's being used as much (only 3 fewer appearances)... and Matusz and Hunter aren't far behind (9 and 10 fewer games, each)... add 10 more pitching days to their schedules and see how they continue to do.

 

Mariano has never pitched more than 74 games in a season. And traditionally would pitch more in the 2nd half than the 1st.

 

Maybe, just maybe, we're baking our bullpen with 5 and 6 inning starts? And maybe, just maybe, your team is only 4-17 when scoring 2 runs or fewer. So... score more, pitch longer.

[varaven45]

Good points DC. We ll play our way out of this funk. It's a 162 game season.

[cravnravn]

DC-- Johnson is struggling, you of all fans dont see that, not only is his control, wait what control, he cant field his position, he looked pathetic Friday night, he needs a break, Norfolk would do him good.

 

We have been calling for Strops head since last September.

[dc.]

Crav - what part of Norfolk isn't an option don't you understand. You can't send players down after a certain number of "options" and after a certain number of years. Johnson is well beyond that. If we "send him to Norfolk" he first goes to "waivers" where any team who wants him can take him.

 

Second, I certainly see the problem. I just don't see a solution that makes sense. Johnson has pitched 43 times this year, that's every other game. So that's every other game that you suddenly need someone to pitch in. Who do you propose does that? We could split it among the other relievers in the pen - that would add 6 games to each of their stat lines. See above to see why that's ludicrous (hint: they are all already overpitched).

 

Or you could just find another arm to fill that void. Sounds easy, but give me a name. Who do we have (not on the major league roster) that could pitch every other day and make you comfortable in a close game or even in a blowout? Say you move Hunter to the closer's role - now you need an 8th inning guy. Who pitches there? Tell me. Please.

 

Third - stop being a moron and calling his fielding an issue. He made an error. That would be one error in 43 appearances. Dangerous stuff. Have you laid off Johnson (or Strop or anyone) when it's someone else's error that cost the team? No.

 

As for Strop - I know you hated Strop. But the same problem sat with him: who or what was the option? "Norfolk" wasn't on the table there, either.

[vmax]

Come on O's! It's 1-0....you can win this!