Is there any hope?

[bmw800]

Now that we've had a night to sleep on this game (well except for me, since I'm on the midnight shift this week and sacrificed sleep for this abomination of a game), I was wondering if we could find a little ray of hope in our chances of making the playoffs. Let me say that I don't, personally, believe it will happen, not with how we've played this year. Despite this, I couldn't help but think about how it could happen:

 

We have 8 games remaining, 8 games that I think can be broken down into 3 categories. The 1st is the games that we absolutely should win, against some of the worst teams in the NFL. We have 3 of these games: at Cleveland, Detroit, and at Oakland. These teams are all fairly terrible, and we shouldn't have a problem with any of them. The only twinge of worry I get is about Calvin Johnson, but really, with that game at home, it should be easy pickings overall. If we lose any of these games, we deserve to go 4-12.

 

The 2nd is the games that we will probably be favored, and should win. These are the games against Chicago and Green Bay. They aren't as cut and dry as the 3 above, but we stand to do well with these teams. Green Bay just lost to Tampa, and have no O-line at all. Even we should be able to pressure them. Their defense isn't so hot either. As for Chicago, they have no offense really. No running game, and their best receivers are Hester and Knox, neither of whom scare me.

 

So, if we can take care of business in the above games, that will leave us with 9 wins. Then come the other 3 games, the Indy game and both Steelers games. If we could win just one of those games and hold serve in the rest, we could at least be 10-6 and start calculating tiebreakers. If we could steal another one, we could be 11-5 again.

 

Now the question is, do we really see the Ravens losing to the Steelers 5 times in a row? Can the fact that Indy has lost damn near everyone in the secondary and a starting linebacker make them vulnerable? An optimist might say no and yes to those questions. And if that's the case, we may just yet make the playoffs

[geo]

Now that we've had a night to sleep on this game (well except for me, since I'm on the midnight shift this week and sacrificed sleep for this abomination of a game), I was wondering if we could find a little ray of hope in our chances of making the playoffs. Let me say that I don't, personally, believe it will happen, not with how we've played this year. Despite this, I couldn't help but think about how it could happen:

 

We have 8 games remaining, 8 games that I think can be broken down into 3 categories. The 1st is the games that we absolutely should win, against some of the worst teams in the NFL. We have 3 of these games: at Cleveland, Detroit, and at Oakland. These teams are all fairly terrible, and we shouldn't have a problem with any of them. The only twinge of worry I get is about Calvin Johnson, but really, with that game at home, it should be easy pickings overall. If we lose any of these games, we deserve to go 4-12.

 

The 2nd is the games that we will probably be favored, and should win. These are the games against Chicago and Green Bay. They aren't as cut and dry as the 3 above, but we stand to do well with these teams. Green Bay just lost to Tampa, and have no O-line at all. Even we should be able to pressure them. Their defense isn't so hot either. As for Chicago, they have no offense really. No running game, and their best receivers are Hester and Knox, neither of whom scare me.

 

So, if we can take care of business in the above games, that will leave us with 9 wins. Then come the other 3 games, the Indy game and both Steelers games. If we could win just one of those games and hold serve in the rest, we could at least be 10-6 and start calculating tiebreakers. If we could steal another one, we could be 11-5 again.

 

Now the question is, do we really see the Ravens losing to the Steelers 5 times in a row? Can the fact that Indy has lost damn near everyone in the secondary and a starting linebacker make them vulnerable? An optimist might say no and yes to those questions. And if that's the case, we may just yet make the playoffs

 

This is not a playoff team, 8-8.

[cravnravn]

I see us finishing at 10-6, no way we beat the Colts, and we'll split with Pittsburgh...We wont get 3 in from the AFCN, so we aint going..San Diego has a betetr record than us and so does Houston.

[varaven45]

This is not a playoff team, 8-8.

 

 

I am with Geo. This is not our year. 8-8 is best case scenario.

[thundercleetz]

I see us 9-7 when it is all said and done. Wins against Cleveland, Green Bay, Detroit, Chicago and Oakland. Loses against Pittsburgh (twice) and Indy. Possibly 8-8 with a loss against Green Bay, but I think we can win that one. We are not a bad team, just not a good team. There is certainly hope for next year, but this year we just need to work on getting better. If we can win the games I said, and split against Pittsburgh, 10-6 is possible. That is a tall order though. I have not given up hope. Lets just start with Cleveland next week.

[Guest BallTMore]

Playoffs are still possible, but not likely.

 

I can see us winning against Clev., Det., and Oak..

 

Manning will end our matchup by halftime. He won't call a run once until he's up by 21.

 

Roethlisber will kill our undisciplined secondary. He'll buy time in the pocket (He probably won't need too with our pass rush) and hit big plays down the field, and I can see our offense struggling against the Steelers D much like they did against Cincinnati.

 

Right now I see 8-8, 9-7 at best.

[vmax]

I don't see the 2009 Ravens making the playoffs. They are not a playoff caliber team....there are several pieces and fundamentals this team lacks.

 

now...I don't regularly post here because I'm a fair weather or band wagon fan. Win or lose I back this team....even when let down or disgusted by performances like yesterday.

 

I do believe they will be playing meaningfull games in December. It might be a tease such as "Not mathematicaly out" or some of the wild card teams hit the skids but we will have games that matter.

 

From a long term fan dating back to the Baltimore Colts, here's the hope that you look for:

 

That the 2009 Ravens close out the second half of the season strong and on a roll that carries over to success for 2010.

You're looking for the answer to "Is this team ready or about to take it to the next level?"

Right now the answer is "no".

 

For example: the 1999 Ravens finished out their last 7 games going 5-2 with wins over division rivals Titans and Steelers (@ Pittsburgh where they had never won). They had their 1st shut out in team history (vs Bengals). They were a few pieces away from being contenders at the close of 1999....mostly on offense. They needed a QB, a RB, a TE, a FB...and Ozzie got them in the off season.

[thundercleetz]

I don't see the 2009 Ravens making the playoffs. They are not a playoff caliber team....there are several pieces and fundamentals this team lacks.

 

now...I don't regularly post here because I'm a fair weather or band wagon fan. Win or lose I back this team....even when let down or disgusted by performances like yesterday.

 

I do believe they will be playing meaningfull games in December. It might be a tease such as "Not mathematicaly out" or some of the wild card teams hit the skids but we will have games that matter.

 

From a long term fan dating back to the Baltimore Colts, here's the hope that you look for:

 

That the 2009 Ravens close out the second half of the season strong and on a roll that carries over to success for 2010.

You're looking for the answer to "Is this team ready or about to take it to the next level?"

Right now the answer is "no".

 

For example: the 1999 Ravens finished out their last 7 games going 5-2 with wins over division rivals Titans and Steelers (@ Pittsburgh where they had never won). They had their 1st shut out in team history (vs Bengals). They were a few pieces away from being contenders at the close of 1999....mostly on offense. They needed a QB, a RB, a TE, a FB...and Ozzie got them in the off season.

 

Piggy backing on this max, I think if this is the case we need to give extensive playing time to Webb, Krueger, and possibly even Justin Harper. We are very weak at CB, pass rush, and WR. I like the aggressiveness I saw out of Webb, he needs to start. I think Foxworth can be a decent #2 corner, but he should not have been matched up against Chad. He was getting killed. Webb played very well out of the slot and on the outside when he was there.

 

Our pass rush has been pathetic. Our blitzes are predictable, and take our guys out of the play (i.e. see Ray Lewis's blitz on Benson's long run). Suggs has been a huge disappointment this year, he get minimal rush. Thus, it is time to let Krueger loose and see if he can get to the QB.

 

Our receiver effort on jump balls downfield has been nonexistent. Harper may drop half of the passes that come his way, but apparently so does Derrick Mason and Mark Clayton. At least Harper can get open and is aggressive in the air for passes. Give the kid a chance.

 

Ray Rice... keep doing your thing. You are on pace for 1,000 yards rushing, 10 rushing TDs, 90+ receptions, and 900 yards receiving. I think we have a mini-LT on our hands here. Great pick Ozzie!

[cravnravn]

If we do make the playoffs, god help us..Unless we draw Denver 1st game..But Palmer, Rothelsberger, Manning, Brady will be licking their chops for shots against our DB's..

[colincac]

Wow, we got worked yesterday but really people, like BMW said, we basically have 5 easy wins the rest of the way. I think we beat Pitt at home as well, and get to 10 wins. Whether or not we make the playoffs, I do not know.

[papasmurfbell]

I am still on my 9-7 from before the season. It is time to start retooling this team. Stop bringing back old men and giving deals to guys who are OK but not world beaters. This team has to get younger. We should bite the bullet for 1 maybe 2 seasons and cast off the guys who will not help us into the future.

 

Now Ray snd Suggs deal have us hamstrung for a while. Find out what kind of value Ed Reed has. Maybe we can get Al to make another stupid move with his 1st round pick again. Maybe Heap has value also.

Gooden cannot be a solid LB. We should look at changing him into a SS. He has the speed and the hitting. If he took off 15 lbs or so he might be able to do it. That is his only way to stay in the league for a long time.

Grubbs and Ngata need to be locked down now. We need to see if Nakamora or Zibi can play.

[thundercleetz]

I am still on my 9-7 from before the season. It is time to start retooling this team. Stop bringing back old men and giving deals to guys who are OK but not world beaters. This team has to get younger. We should bite the bullet for 1 maybe 2 seasons and cast off the guys who will not help us into the future.

 

Now Ray snd Suggs deal have us hamstrung for a while. Find out what kind of value Ed Reed has. Maybe we can get Al to make another stupid move with his 1st round pick again. Maybe Heap has value also.

Gooden cannot be a solid LB. We should look at changing him into a SS. He has the speed and the hitting. If he took off 15 lbs or so he might be able to do it. That is his only way to stay in the league for a long time.

Grubbs and Ngata need to be locked down now. We need to see if Nakamora or Zibi can play.

 

Younger is not always better. We got younger at corner, linebacker, and kicker, but that has not worked out very well, has it? The good thing about the NFL is that teams can retool quickly in one offseason. I do not think the situation is as bleak as you make it. Ray, Suggs, and Ed are not the problem. Sure Suggs is overpaid, but he doesn't hurt us out there. Ed might be done because of his injury.

[OutsideRzAcE]

Younger is not always better. We got younger at corner, linebacker, and kicker, but that has not worked out very well, has it? The good thing about the NFL is that teams can retool quickly in one offseason. I do not think the situation is as bleak as you make it. Ray, Suggs, and Ed are not the problem. Sure Suggs is overpaid, but he doesn't hurt us out there. Ed might be done because of his injury.

 

Harbaugh says Ed just had a bad game, and though the neck is a factor, it's as good as it's been in two years:

"I think he's tackled very well this year, up until this game," Harbaugh said at his weekly news conference Monday. "Obviously, the hit against Denver was as good a tackle as you're ever going to see. From my understanding, the neck is as good as it's been in two years, but I think it's a factor. But it's not a dangerous type thing where he's at risk, or he wouldn't be playing."

 

link

[thundercleetz]

Harbaugh says Ed just had a bad game, and though the neck is a factor, it's as good as it's been in two years:

"I think he's tackled very well this year, up until this game," Harbaugh said at his weekly news conference Monday. "Obviously, the hit against Denver was as good a tackle as you're ever going to see. From my understanding, the neck is as good as it's been in two years, but I think it's a factor. But it's not a dangerous type thing where he's at risk, or he wouldn't be playing."

 

link

 

That is good to hear!

 

Back to the topic on hope, lets just take this season one game at a time. I for one am looking forward toward seeing a complete domination of the Browns next week. That should be enjoyable. We'll deal with Indy and Pittsburgh when they come. Lets just enjoy the Browns game.

[varaven45]

There's always hope but this team lacks character, chemistry, talent and consistency.

 

As unpopular and painful as this will be, the end of Ray and Reed era is nearing rapidly. Ray cant keep up with RBs any more and Reed makes more bonehead plays and whiffs than ballhawking, feelancing picks and fumble recoveries.

 

Organizationally, we need to accept and bring in some youth to replace these guys. I am convinced we dont have thse guys on our current roster.

 

If we draft properly and make the prudent FA choices (not Foxworthy!), we can retool our D in 1-2 years. We have and we'll continue to take our lumps but this organization needs to bite the bullet.

 

At worst, we are a 7-9 and 8-8 for this season and next. With the right moves and transitioning, I believe we can be a playoff team for years to come.

[geo]

I am still on my 9-7 from before the season. It is time to start retooling this team. Stop bringing back old men and giving deals to guys who are OK but not world beaters. This team has to get younger. We should bite the bullet for 1 maybe 2 seasons and cast off the guys who will not help us into the future.

 

Now Ray snd Suggs deal have us hamstrung for a while. Find out what kind of value Ed Reed has. Maybe we can get Al to make another stupid move with his 1st round pick again. Maybe Heap has value also.

Gooden cannot be a solid LB. We should look at changing him into a SS. He has the speed and the hitting. If he took off 15 lbs or so he might be able to do it. That is his only way to stay in the league for a long time.

Grubbs and Ngata need to be locked down now. We need to see if Nakamora or Zibi can play.

 

Grubbs over Gaither, at this point? I think Grubbs is not a concern until 12-13, and Gaither will be RFA now, I think Gaither should be our first target.

 

As for Nakamura and Zibi I agree we have to find out.

[papasmurfbell]

No it is better to get younger. Housh needs time to struggle much like Stover's 75% season in 1990 or 91. This was a go nowhere season from day one. So take your lumps. I wanted to take those lumps last yr but they went for a run. Suggs is hurting us by not getting to the QB. That hurts the DB's. Also his salary could be used for more useful players. They should have dealt with CB with the draft. there simply was very little talent as FA in that position. Ellerbe and McClain look to be solid at LB. Gooden is just not a LB in the NFL.

 

I call BS on Ed's neck. He is very hurt. His one arm is basically useless.

 

Grubbs is in yr 4 I believe. He has 2 more yrs that he can be a RFA if they do not get a CBA done. Gaither has 3 more yrs. As of now Gaither has not proven to me that he should get a big contract.

 

What we need is to not put our heads in the sand. We need the truth and the FO to deal with the holes on this roster.

[dc.]

Scary to think about ... but I still think 9-7 or 10-6 is possible. I also think its entirely possible 9-7 gets a playoff birth, MAYBE.

 

Playoff breakdown...

 

Right now: Indy running away. NE running away. Pitt and Cincy both with obvious advantages over us.

 

That leaves 1 spot for a WC and 1 spot for the AFCW champ (Denver or San Diego).

 

Denver (6-2) has a 2 game lead on us but is fading quickly (against good teams). San Diego (5-3) has just one game on us. Houston (5-4) just half a game. Which means that all are within striking distance of us.

 

Houston: has to play Indy again, as well as New England and Miami. Even their game against Tenn might be more interesting than expect. But they have a few hard games to follow.

 

SD: Also 4 tough games... Philly, Denver (who they already lost to), Cincy and Dallas.

 

Denver: SD, NYG, Indy, Philly

 

If SD and Hou lose their 'tough' games... that puts them both at 9-7. We hold the head to head tie break with the SD. The Hou tie break would be much more complicated - I think they'd win thanks to a win over Cincy, but not sure. But that also assumes they (or we) don't lose a game we should win. As mentioned, Hou-Tenn could be very interesting (it was the first time through)

 

 

Anyway.... there is lots of hope and life. As much as I'd like to give up... I don't want to. More than anything else, though, the Ravens lack of passion against the Bengals has been killing me. Maybe they just have our number.

[geo]

No it is better to get younger. Housh needs time to struggle much like Stover's 75% season in 1990 or 91. This was a go nowhere season from day one. So take your lumps. I wanted to take those lumps last yr but they went for a run. Suggs is hurting us by not getting to the QB. That hurts the DB's. Also his salary could be used for more useful players. They should have dealt with CB with the draft. there simply was very little talent as FA in that position. Ellerbe and McClain look to be solid at LB. Gooden is just not a LB in the NFL.

 

I call BS on Ed's neck. He is very hurt. His one arm is basically useless.

 

Grubbs is in yr 4 I believe. He has 2 more yrs that he can be a RFA if they do not get a CBA done. Gaither has 3 more yrs. As of now Gaither has not proven to me that he should get a big contract.

 

What we need is to not put our heads in the sand. We need the truth and the FO to deal with the holes on this roster.

 

No RFA for firstrounders i think?

Grubbs is in his third years just like Gaither, so he has two years left, however tagging a guard is more friendly than other positions. Gaithers rookie contract is over when this season ends, he will be a RFA just like the rest of the 2007 class like Yanda, McClain, Troy and Barnes. Burgess has to be a UFA, rigth?

 

Btw you are rigth about Stover his first 3 seasons he had basically same stats as hauschka, and 8 out 11..we knew that it would be like that.

[papasmurfbell]

Yes 1st rounder can be tagged. You cannot get FA until after your 4th season. If there is not new CBA then it goes to yr 6.

[raysbiggestfan]

as much as i love this team, i am gonna have to be objective! i am very pissed off at getting swept by the freaking bengals,, but whatever. the fact is, is if the ravens don't get their act together soon, they will be watching the playoffs from the sidelines, which is very dissapointing, because there is so much talent on this team.