Robjr83 Posted May 13, 2016 Posted May 13, 2016 Yeah its not really the late rounders that hurt its just the 1-4 rounders are the ones you expect to at least make a NFL roster. Torrey was the best one and he'd be a #2 on most rosters. I'd rather they'd bundle those 4th round picks and either trade with a team for a proven WR (like Boldin) or move into the 3rd for better talent. Its interesting in this teams 20+ year history they only have a handful of WRs picked in rounds 1-3, so your talking maybe 6 picks out of 60 Quote
GrubberRaven Posted May 13, 2016 Posted May 13, 2016 Jermaine Lewis - 5th round pick. Nobody of note drafted after him. Was a decent return man and a big part of our 1st Superbowl team. I would say this is a good 5th round pick at WR/KR.James Roe - 6th round pick. Did nothing. Out of the league in 3 years.Patrick Johnson - 2nd round pick. 2 notable WRs drafted within a round after PJ were Joe Jurevicius and Hines Ward. Major bust here.Brandon Stokley - 4th round pick. Had a pretty good career for a 4th round pick but his notable years were spent away from Baltimore. Bust for us but not a bust overall.Travis Taylor - Major bust at #10 overall but no one else taken after him did anything. Plaxico Burress went a couple picks earlier and had a good career. There were some decent WRs drafted from the late 3rd round on in that draft.Ron Johnson - 4th round pick. Bust but no one taken in the next couple of rounds at WR did anything either.Javin Hunter - 6th round pick. Did nothing and nobody of note at WR taken after him.Devard Darling - 3rd round pick. Bust. Could have had Jerricho Cotchery who has had a servicable career for a 3rd round pick. Wasn't much else on offer that year.Derek Abney - 7th round pick. Never made the team.Mark Clayton - 1st round pick. Bust. Could have had Roddy White! Demetrius Williams - 4th round pick. Showed flashes for a couple of seasons but never developed. Bust. Could have had Brandon Marshall who went a dozen picks later.Yamon Figurs ( drafted in 3rd and traded a 2nd for it) - Bust. Could have had James Jones who had a pretty good career. Other servicable 3rd round picks that year include Laurent Robinson and Mike Sims-Walker.Marcus Smith - 4th round pick. Did nothing in 3 years and then out of football. Only WR of note taken later was Josh Morgan in the 6th who has had a pretty decent career.Justin Harper - 7th round pick. Did nothing in 3 year and is a bust because we could have had Stevie Johnson who has had a good career most notably with the Bills.David Reed - 5th round pick. Bust. Could have had Antonio Brown or even Riley Cooper.Torrey Smith - 2nd round pick. Has had a good career but never developed his game beyond running the 9. Probably the first receiver that we have drafted that has done anything and he doesn't get passed his rookie contract. That said he wasn't worth the contract he got in the end. Could have had Randall Cobb.Tandon Doss - 4th round pick. Bust but only Denarius Moore showed anything from later in that draft.Tommy Streeter - 6th round pick. Has bounced around the league. Wouldn't say bust but his best year was after he left Baltimore.Aaron Mellette - 7th round pick. Only lasted a year. No one of note taken after him.Michael Campanaro - 7th round pick. I like him but he can't stay on the field.Breshad Perriman - 1st round pick. Injured, hasn't played a down. A little too early to call a bust. Dorial Green Beckham has the potential to be a star. Devin Funchess showed up for the Panthers last year. Tyler Lockett has looked good in Seattle. Perriman needs a first season like those guys or he teeters on the brink of being a bust.Darren Waller - Has potential but I think is being moved to TE? While we have had no success it's not as if the WRs taken after our picks have consistently turned out to be great. Sure there are always going to be misses but the % of hits post our pick is very low. Yes in this analysis you also point out that where there were no notable receivers drafted after our pics. This brings to my attention that other teams wiffed on WRs, am I right? Quote
oldno82 Posted May 13, 2016 Posted May 13, 2016 Yeah its not really the late rounders that hurt its just the 1-4 rounders are the ones you expect to at least make a NFL roster. Torrey was the best one and he'd be a #2 on most rosters. I'd rather they'd bundle those 4th round picks and either trade with a team for a proven WR (like Boldin)...Best idea I've heard in a long time. Quote
cravnravn Posted May 14, 2016 Posted May 14, 2016 prior to 08, who'd we have at qb. we could of had Jerry rice and Randy Moss out there from 2002 thru 2007 and they wouldn't have been any good. it starts with who's behind the center Quote
tsylvester Posted May 14, 2016 Posted May 14, 2016 prior to 08, who'd we have at qb. we could of had Jerry rice and Randy Moss out there from 2002 thru 2007 and they wouldn't have been any good. it starts with who's behind the center There is some truth to that, not entirely, but some. Does a receiver make a quarterback, or does a quarterback make a receiver? There is no doubt Swan and Stallworth made Bradshaw. But did Rice make Montanna & Young? Did Michael Jackson and Derrick Alexander make Vinnie? Quote
thundercleetz Posted May 14, 2016 Posted May 14, 2016 It's hard to play the "should have" game unless you're comparing apples to apples: for example we should have taken Pharoh Cooper over Chris Moore, Roddy White over Mark Clayton. Who knows where we had Antonio Brown rated. 25 teams passed on him in the sixth round alone. Hard to know what his value was on our board versus a high potential OT. We had taken David Reed the round before. We were not going to take another WR in the sixth round. If we want to question a pick, it should be why we had Reed rated higher than Brown? Both guys coming out were projected as average sized slot guys with return ability. The one thing that will stick out to me is that year how we let Dez Bryant go one pick before us and didn't even seem to make an effort to trade up. That was the Sergio Kindle and Terrance Cody draft where Ozzie got too cute. All things considered that was Ozzie's worst draft. I hope we did not make the same mistake missing out on trading up for Ramsey. Quote
tsylvester Posted May 14, 2016 Posted May 14, 2016 That is it in a nut shell isn't it Tc; the way they have rated players the past few drafts. Sure, we can see now that some one is wrong either in the scouting or which scouts they place more faith in for college players. Obviously Ozzy has ths last say, but clearly something is a miss. If none of these draft picks works out, I don't see how Biscut can keep from making major changes... Quote
cravnravn Posted May 15, 2016 Posted May 15, 2016 There is some truth to that, not entirely, but some. Does a receiver make a quarterback, or does a quarterback make a receiver? There is no doubt Swan and Stallworth made Bradshaw. But did Rice make Montanna & Young? Did Michael Jackson and Derrick Alexander make Vinnie?Unitas had Barry & Orr...case closed Quote
cravnravn Posted May 15, 2016 Posted May 15, 2016 It's hard to play the "should have" game unless you're comparing apples to apples: for example we should have taken Pharoh Cooper over Chris Moore, Roddy White over Mark Clayton. Who knows where we had Antonio Brown rated. 25 teams passed on him in the sixth round alone. Hard to know what his value was on our board versus a high potential OT. We had taken David Reed the round before. We were not going to take another WR in the sixth round. If we want to question a pick, it should be why we had Reed rated higher than Brown? Both guys coming out were projected as average sized slot guys with return ability. The one thing that will stick out to me is that year how we let Dez Bryant go one pick before us and didn't even seem to make an effort to trade up. That was the Sergio Kindle and Terrance Cody draft where Ozzie got too cute. All things considered that was Ozzie's worst draft.I hope we did not make the same mistake missing out on trading up for Ramsey.of course I had to argue with a Stealers fan while at the barber, he insisted that Brown is the greatest since sliced bread..I gently reminded him that his Stealers are 0 for the last 5 vs our purple birds.. I got us covered in the south ;) Quote
cravnravn Posted May 15, 2016 Posted May 15, 2016 There is some truth to that, not entirely, but some. Does a receiver make a quarterback, or does a quarterback make a receiver? There is no doubt Swan and Stallworth made Bradshaw. But did Rice make Montanna & Young? Did Michael Jackson and Derrick Alexander make Vinnie? is a 40 pound worm fat? Quote
tsylvester Posted May 15, 2016 Posted May 15, 2016 is a 40 pound worm fat?He is if his name is pinky. Quote
tsylvester Posted May 15, 2016 Posted May 15, 2016 Unitas had Barry & Orr...case closedOh so Johnny U was not that good, his receivers made him look good? Quote
cravnravn Posted May 15, 2016 Posted May 15, 2016 no. shoulda clarified. the qb made the wr in Johnny's era. Quote
oldno82 Posted May 15, 2016 Posted May 15, 2016 Good receivers and good passers are both needed for a successful passing game. Quote
RavenMad Posted May 16, 2016 Posted May 16, 2016 It's hard to play the "should have" game unless you're comparing apples to apples: for example we should have taken Pharoh Cooper over Chris Moore, Roddy White over Mark Clayton. Who knows where we had Antonio Brown rated. 25 teams passed on him in the sixth round alone. Hard to know what his value was on our board versus a high potential OT. We had taken David Reed the round before. We were not going to take another WR in the sixth round. If we want to question a pick, it should be why we had Reed rated higher than Brown? Both guys coming out were projected as average sized slot guys with return ability. The one thing that will stick out to me is that year how we let Dez Bryant go one pick before us and didn't even seem to make an effort to trade up. That was the Sergio Kindle and Terrance Cody draft where Ozzie got too cute. All things considered that was Ozzie's worst draft. I hope we did not make the same mistake missing out on trading up for Ramsey. That's just it in a nut shell. What ever metric we are using to evaluate and grade WRs isn't working. None of the guys have come in here and developed. Any year we need a WR we would be better served trading for a proven vet. Over the last 10 years the WRs that have performed the best have been Derrick Mason (Was a UFA), Anquan Boldin (Traded 3rd and 5th round picks) and Steve Smith (was a cap casualty release by the Panthers). If we are poor at evaluating WRs in the draft then why don't we trade picks for the proven vets who seem to do well when they come here? Quote
vmax Posted May 16, 2016 Author Posted May 16, 2016 Real good thread and discussion here....although it is depressing looking at all the failures.Thanks everyone. You throw the ball, you catch the ball. It's that simple.How do these guys make it to this level and not know how to snare anything near them? Quote
tsylvester Posted May 17, 2016 Posted May 17, 2016 Speed of the game, pressure from better coverages, confusion from coverages, the list could go on as to why... Oh yeah and the ball is slightly bigger... Quote
cravnravn Posted May 17, 2016 Posted May 17, 2016 Speed of the game, pressure from better coverages, confusion from coverages, the list could go on as to why... Oh yeah and the ball is slightly bigger...definitely the reads by our WR's or lack thereof. Boldin of late is the only WR to gain separation from the db's. Torrey had separation but ony on the go route. did I see this right, Boldin is a free agent? Quote
Robjr83 Posted May 17, 2016 Posted May 17, 2016 IMO Ravens never really seem to draft "hands guys" at WR. Other than Stokely, Clayton, Mallete, and Camp thats the only guys coming out of the draft who were solid catchers. At TE we had some good ones in Heap and Pitta. Joe does well with chain movers so why does Ozzie not invest in getting them? Quote
oldno82 Posted May 17, 2016 Posted May 17, 2016 definitely the reads by our WR's or lack thereof. Boldin of late is the only WR to gain separation from the db's. Torrey had separation but ony on the go route. did I see this right, Boldin is a free agent?Yup. Anquan is a free agent. Quote
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