It is now time to talk about the draft

[rastaman831226]

You guys are arguing over spilled milk, it doesn't matter at this point.

There's no argument. It's football talk past and present. Why would you characterize it as argument?

[thundercleetz]

https://itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/espn-first-draft/id304434112?mt=2

 

First podcast of the year for Kiper and McShay. Kiper mentioned Breshad Perriman as one of his favorite players no one is talking about. Perriman is a big, fast WR ftom UCF. Averaged over 20 YPC for the past two years.

[thundercleetz]

Another name to the WR list: Chris Conley from Georgia.

 

http://www.nfl.com/combine/profiles/Chris-Conley?id=2552652&id=2552652

 

Good measurements. Scouting reports say he runs good routes.

[thundercleetz]

@RavensInsider: Georgia WR Chris Conley (6-2, 213) is crushing the combine today: 4.35 in the 40, 45-inch vertical leap, 11-7 broad jump, 18 bench reps

 

A 45-inch standing vertical is unhuman. That's probably better than most receiver's one step jump.

[thundercleetz]

All the top big receivers are running really well: White a 4.35, Cooper a 4.42, DGB a 4.49, Parker a 4.45 and Strong ran a faster than expected 4.44. The smaller guys ran well as expected, Dorsett a 4.33, Smith a 4.42. Perryman didn't run due to a pulled hamstring.

 

Funchess ran a 4.7. Kelvin Benjamin ran a poor 40 time last year and still went in the first.

 

With everyone running well it is difficult to say anyone jumped up or down in the rankings. A lot will depend on how teams have these guys ranked, making it hard to project. It will be a very competitive first round for these receivers.

[tsylvester]

Conley has suspect hands, he often loses focus over the middle & on the deep routes, taking for ganted the "easy" catches.

 

One name who did very, very welland I would not be surprised to see the Ravens take at 26, Jaelon Strong, ASU. 4.4 in the 40, great route runner, strong, big hands & he can return punts if need be....

 

 

My dream would be white, no surprise, I started the thread about him his sic 4.35 for a man his size, wowed even me, dude just glides & strides...

 

Funches did nothing to move his stock up, likely moved down. Some players play faster than they time, he plays about the same and his suspect hands, lackadaisical route running leave a lot to be desired.

 

He would fit the nix for the Ravens though, a mix between tight end and wide out; problem is, he hates going over the middle based on what I saw of him over the past couple years......

[thundercleetz]

Conley has suspect hands, he often loses focus over the middle & on the deep routes, taking for ganted the "easy" catches.

 

One name who did very, very welland I would not be surprised to see the Ravens take at 26, Jaelon Strong, ASU. 4.4 in the 40, great route runner, strong, big hands & he can return punts if need be....

 

 

My dream would be white, no surprise, I started the thread about him his sic 4.35 for a man his size, wowed even me, dude just glides & strides...

 

Funches did nothing to move his stock up, likely moved down. Some players play faster than they time, he plays about the same and his suspect hands, lackadaisical route running leave a lot to be desired.

 

He would fit the nix for the Ravens though, a mix between tight end and wide out; problem is, he hates going over the middle based on what I saw of him over the past couple years......

After the combine I see what you mean on White, the guy has the makings of a stud!

 

I like Strong a lot for the reasons you mentioned. He seems like exactly what we need. Not only did he run a fast 40, his vertical was over 40 inches and he put up 17 on the bench press. SS time was good too (4.3). The guy seems like a ball player!

 

As far as DGB, he ran a slower SS than 40 time (SS of 4.5, 40 of 4.49). Add in the fact he only put up 13 on the bench press at 237 pounds (long arms maybe?) and a vertical leap of only 33 inches (poor lower body strength?) and I have worries about his ability to get off the press, which is a common critique of his game. Now the SS is very much an art, so if a guy his size didn't practice the drill, I can understand the poor time. However that 40 yard dash number means nothing if he can't get off the press or burst in and out of his routes.

 

Tim, what's your opinion on Parker from Louisville? How does he compare to Strong? It seems most people have Parker slotted after White/Cooper but before Strong/DGB. Where do you see him?

[tsylvester]

DGB is lazy, he clearly did not prepare for the combine, he was out of shape. I was not surprised by his 40, I mentioned players who play faster than they time and he is one of them. He has shown quickness and agility, along with the ability to get off the jam in games, but this combine, something was up with him which only leads one to believe to stay away, given his off the field issues.

 

Parker, I love, I think I covered him early in the thread. He is a play maker just like the Ravens need. To me, White is far & away the best in this draft, then, in my opinion, it is parker. His length, body style, speed, hands, quickness all lead me to believe he will be very productive and stay healthy (key) in the NFL.

 

 

I don't think he will be there when the Ravens pick, if he is, they have to take him, he would be both the best player on the board and best player they need.

 

the 40 is a key yes, but as you touched on, look at the vertical, the long jump, short shuttle and 3 cone drill times. They all speak to explosion, quickness, elusiveness in a player, no matter the position.

[thundercleetz]

DGB is lazy, he clearly did not prepare for the combine, he was out of shape. I was not surprised by his 40, I mentioned players who play faster than they time and he is one of them. He has shown quickness and agility, along with the ability to get off the jam in games, but this combine, something was up with him which only leads one to believe to stay away, given his off the field issues.

 

Parker, I love, I think I covered him early in the thread. He is a play maker just like the Ravens need. To me, White is far & away the best in this draft, then, in my opinion, it is parker. His length, body style, speed, hands, quickness all lead me to believe he will be very productive and stay healthy (key) in the NFL.

 

 

I don't think he will be there when the Ravens pick, if he is, they have to take him, he would be both the best player on the board and best player they need.

 

the 40 is a key yes, but as you touched on, look at the vertical, the long jump, short shuttle and 3 cone drill times. They all speak to explosion, quickness, elusiveness in a player, no matter the position.

Thanks for the analysis. When I first looked at Parker's 2014 stats I thought "that's not impressive". Then I saw they were for only six games! I watched Parker's highlights and he makes everyone look so easy and effortless. Great body control and timing, especially on the deep balls. He doesn't give away his position like Torrey does, he only lifts his head when the ball is ready to be caught, making it difficult for the defender. Parker's hands aren't as big as White, DGB or Strong, but drops or body catching didn't look to be a problem. I've seen pro comparisons to AJ Green, Alshon Jeffries and Hakeem Nicks for Parker.

 

Hopefully a couple of the team's lower than us in the draft will sign WRs in FA and/or one of those teams reached on DGB. If Parker is there at around 20, I would love to see us move up for him.

[thundercleetz]

http://www.nfl.com/combine/profiles/David-Johnson?id=2552377&id=2552377

 

David Johnson killed it at the combine. Trestman loves backs who can catch the ball. Forte and Charlie Gardner in Oakland both had 100 catch years under Trestman, and Michael Pittman was a good pass catching back in Tampa. Johnson might have moved himself into the second round.

[RavenMad]

Jaelen Strong is my draft crush for this year. He's big, fast and has good hands. I love how he adjusts and plucks the ball out of the air. I think he is exactly what Joe needs.

[tsylvester]

TC, did you see the db from UConn had a 12'.3" broad jump and 44" high jump! He didn't run the 40 (estimates out to a 4.34), didn't need to with those measurables.... He is a project player, late round pick but I am sure some team will take him early because of those numbers.

[tsylvester]

I noticed Ozzie really sitting up straight when the kid from Lousiville, Charles Gaines, ran his 40 (4.4) and went through the db drills including the gauntlet; he was very, very impressive.

 

Doran Grant, 4.44, OSU, and while Trae Waynes, MSU, 4.31 was fabulous as expected, I doubt the Ravens get a shot at him...

[thundercleetz]

TC, did you see the db from UConn had a 12'.3" broad jump and 44" high jump! He didn't run the 40 (estimates out to a 4.34), didn't need to with those measurables.... He is a project player, late round pick but I am sure some team will take him early because of those numbers.

Inhuman... Even the US Olympic team took notice of that!

[thundercleetz]

I noticed Ozzie really sitting up straight when the kid from Lousiville, Charles Gaines, ran his 40 (4.4) and went through the db drills including the gauntlet; he was very, very impressive.

 

Doran Grant, 4.44, OSU, and while Trae Waynes, MSU, 4.31 was fabulous as expected, I doubt the Ravens get a shot at him...

After that combine performance, where do you see Gaines going in the draft? A RS Sophomore with only one year of playing experience... But had 14 INTs. I know critics say he took a lot of chances, but if simply taking chances got you 14 picks, everyone would do it. So there has to be some serious talent and instincts there.

 

Corners tested very well. I am getting worried all of the top corner and WR targets will be gone by the time we pick...

 

Edit: sorry I got Holliman and Gaines mixed up from UofL. I was talking about Holliman.

[tsylvester]

After that combine performance, where do you see Gaines going in the draft? A RS Sophomore with only one year of playing experience... But had 14 INTs. I know critics say he took a lot of chances, but if simply taking chances got you 14 picks, everyone would do it. So there has to be some serious talent and instincts there.

 

Corners tested very well. I am getting worried all of the top corner and WR targets will be gone by the time we pick...

 

 

Gaines I would expect to go in the late second, maybe middle 3rd; the Ravens have a real chance to land him. They don't really need a ready to go corner like Waynes, though that would be nice, but a player like Gaines or Grant would be perfect. I think for what the Ravens need at corner, there is depth that just needs to develope.

 

Wide outs, as we have talked about in this thread, no worries there at all, it is very, very deep with ready to play receivers. The only worry for me is; do the Ravens think they need one early....

 

I was not a happy camper when they let Jordan Mathews slide by them last year, I will be a very grumpy camper if they do the same with Strong, Parker or even Shaq Washington (who they can get later) or his teamate Mekale McKay later, if they both came out, not sure if they did.... both are keepers,

[oldno82]

Jaelen Strong is my draft crush for this year. He's big, fast and has good hands. I love how he adjusts and plucks the ball out of the air. I think he is exactly what Joe needs.

My thoughts too. And he should be there at 26. But, Oz always goes BPA. I don't agree with that all the time but his record is pretty good.

[thundercleetz]

Free agency will change a lot of teams drafting philosophy. However there is a good chance all of our receiver targets could be off the board. If so, Marcus Peters and Bud Dupree look like potential targets.

[papasmurfbell]

http://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/nfl/ravens/2015/02/16/john-harbaugh-nfl-combine-draft-ray-rice-experience/23510637/

Ravens' draft process will include heightened awareness

As he prepared for another trip to Indianapolis and the step of sizing up draft prospects at the NFL scouting combine this week, John Harbaugh realized that it's not quite business as usual.

It has been a year since former Baltimore Ravens running back Ray Rice took the trip to Atlantic City with his now-wife Janay that provided the impetus to change the game in the NFL for dealing with domestic violence.

"I think we've all learned a lot about domestic violence issues over the past year," Harbaugh, the Ravens coach, told USA TODAY Sports on Monday as he took a break from videotape study. "For me (before Rice), it was never too close to home. I was never affected by it personally. It was something that I read about.

"But this has been an eye-opener. This is a watershed moment."

Harbaugh contends that the biggest takeaway for him from the Rice matter is that domestic violence is a societal issue that the NFL is positioned to lead in addressing. Yet beneath that umbrella is the added added responsibility that the Ravens have to assume as they evaluate players they will consider bringing into the organization.

The Ravens, whose football moves are headed by widely-respected general manager Ozzie Newsome, will proceed during the draft process with increased emphasis on domestic violence issues, a person with knowledge of the team's operations told USA TODAY Sports. The person did not want to be identified because of the sensitive nature of the subject.

Yet even though in Rice's case there were no apparent signs to suggest that he would knock out his then-fiancee' with a punch in an elevator, the team is taking stronger steps -- including the enlistment of new security consultants to handle investigations -- to avoid potential pitfalls.

Sure, there's a reactionary current that runs through this. The Ravens were humbled to use a word team owner Steve Bisciotti expressed during the crisis.

But this also reflects the manner in which a brain trust that until the Rice episode had a sterling reputation for its integrity, is attempting to apply lessons learned from the Rice fiasco -- even while, ironically, team security director Darren Sanders is on paid leave while facing his own legal issues stemming from an alleged incident that involved a woman.

They are trying to back up their expressed intentions by revising some of the ways they have done business.

In previous years, domestic violence situations typically would be considered in a category that might have included other off-the-field concerns – such as substance-abuse or anger-management issues – the thinking now is that abuse against women is in a separate category regarded as the most serious of issues.

With the beefed-up investigative resources, the Ravens are digging to learn more information than ever about how prospects have engaged with women in their lives – even situations that didn't rise to any criminal complaints, but may merely reflect a contentious relationship in other ways.

Harbaugh said he isn't sure whether the Ravens will remove more players than in years past due to character concerns. But it's early in that process.

I'm guessing that, provided the investigations warrant it, it's a given the team will be prone to disqualify more players from its draft board due to character concerns.

When Harbaugh visits with prospects during interviews at the combine this week, he will undoubtedly bring a different perspective due to the experience of the Rice case – and the embarrassing fallout that exposed flaws in the Ravens' handling of the matter.

Even so, he insists that the basic foundation of the evaluation process itself hasn't changed when trying to learn about a player's character during an interview.

Like all teams at the combine, the Ravens can conduct 15-minute interviews with up to 60 players.

The interview team will include Newsome, Harbaugh, assistant general manager Eric DeCosta, college scouting director Joe Hortiz and pro personnel director Vince Newsome, plus, depending on a player's position, the presence of the coordinators and various position coaches.

"We're just trying to get a read on what kind of heart a guy has," Harbaugh said. "You want to know what kind of choices they've made, and if they've made bad choices, what have they done to rectify it?"

On one level, teams have always sought to identify players with concerns to weigh in the draft equation. That's standard procedure for every team in the NFL.

Yet the stakes are so much higher now for the Ravens, with the credibility of the franchise having taken such a major hit during the Rice fiasco.

On top of that, further questions are raised about the organization's culture when considering that Sanders is on paid leave while facing an assault charge and alleged sexual violation stemming from an incident involving a woman at M&T Bank Stadium.

On Feb. 2, the team officially released defensive tackle Terrence Cody, as he was indicted on animal cruelty charges. Cody's contract was up and he was due to become a free agent, but by cutting him immediately the Ravens sent a clear message about the tolerance they will have for off-the-field issues.

Including Rice, five Ravens players were arrested last year.

While it's unfair to link each case with the others, the perception is not good.

And it will follow the Ravens throughout this critical draft process.

This is screaming DGB is not an option.

[OneManCypher]

It's a fake out move, DGB is the pick if he's there

[papasmurfbell]

Not after this past yr.

[thundercleetz]

From the State of Ravens it sounded pretty clear any prospect with domestic violence history would be off the board.

[tsylvester]

It's a fake out move, DGB is the pick if he's there

 

 

Not a chane the Ravens take him given what his past is like and what he did or failed to do at the combine. Let some one else take the chance he is a hall of fame player or a bust.

[tsylvester]

Free agency will change a lot of teams drafting philosophy. However there is a good chance all of our receiver targets could be off the board. If so, Marcus Peters and Bud Dupree look like potential targets.

 

 

I am not familiar with either of them, however, this gives me great pause on Peters-

 

Suspended for one game in 2014 by head coach Chris Petersen for a sideline tantrum that followed personal foul penalty. Was ultimately dismissed from team over multiple run-ins with coaching staff. Inconsistent with footwork and loose with technique. Lacks patience in press and will open up early. Grabby off line of scrimmage and downfield when beaten. Average mirror-and-match and long speed. Overly emotional and prone to mental mistakes because of it. Slower than expected to squeeze routes in space. Doesn't take coaching.

 

 

 

 

While his positives are very good & maybe getting drafted low or not at all would help him "mature", I don't think he is what the Ravens would be looking for on this team, attitude wise.

 

Now, Dupre sounds a lot like McPhee when he first came out, nice pick up. He would make a nice replacement, getting needed expereince on the becn & practice squad, moving slowly into the line up ala McPhee...

 

Dupree is an explosive, powerful athlete with a background in basketball. While he's been productive at Kentucky, his tape doesn't always do his potential justice. He must continue to improve as a pass rusher, but his traits are undeniable. Difference between being good and great might be his coordinator

 

[thundercleetz]

 

 

I am not familiar with either of them, however, this gives me great pause on Peters-

 

 

 

 

While his positives are very good & maybe getting drafted low or not at all would help him "mature", I don't think he is what the Ravens would be looking for on this team, attitude wise.

 

Now, Dupre sounds a lot like McPhee when he first came out, nice pick up. He would make a nice replacement, getting needed expereince on the becn & practice squad, moving slowly into the line up ala McPhee...

 

The reason I mention Peters: it depends on the information the Ravens get on him and how the interviews go. If the Ravens get a good impression on him, I think he is a realistic target in that presents clear value above what is projected to be available at 26. Of course the Ravens could trade back. Mel Kiper says he only has 16 players with first round grades. I simply think Peters is a BPA option.

 

On Dupree: my little brother goes to UK and is very high on him. Dupree is a freak athlete who has the ability to chase down sweeps from the opposite of the field. On top of that he was a great student and has solid character. He's the type of player who projects as a better pro than college player. My little brother told me the UK back-end was terrible so team would constantly expose it with quick passes before the pass rush had any chance. Further more teams would run away from Dupree because the defense had nothing else.

 

Once again I see Dupree as a BPA type pick for us. Especially considering we need a young pass rusher.